OurPath (formerly SSN) Open Forum / Mixed Orientation Marriages - Pathways to Success

**Posted by Daryl** October 9, 2016 10:50 pm

Steve - I recall the name but came late to the game so never knew what exactly the issue was.

Jersey Girl - I must object to the implication in this comment of yours .....

"why can those who are no longer a str8 spouse (as they are no longer married and thus are actually not fitting the description for this board) not understand that there are actually MOMs that DO work out?"

Are you suggesting that as soon as we separate or divorce we have no place here? I call BS on that. Once you've been a straight spouse you always are. My personal history doesn't just disappear. As long as I feel I have a valuable contribution to make on this board I most certainly will continue to post as I see fit. As should you. For what it's worth, I don't think all MOM's are doomed to fail but I do believe that success absolutely requires two people who are 101% committed to making it work. What makes it work? Only someone who's been there can really answer that.

Very little here is short and simple. The more information the better in my opinion. The more sides of the different coins you see the better placed you are to choose which one to flip.

**Posted by JerseyGirl** October 10, 2016 8:57 am

Then perhaps when we DO post and say that not all MOMs are doomed to failure, we shouldn't get jumped on and told that they will? Y'all can do that to us when we come here and post, yet when we call you on it, we get told that there are other places to go to talk about it? Such a warm and welcoming place! And sharing one of those places for those who don't know about it and might see something positive instead of post after post of "Run for the hills and don't look back!!" is wrong?

You say come here more often and make a difference? So now that we are coming here, we get told that there are other places to go and we are not supposed to get defensive for the negative feedback we get? Vicky and I both posted that not all MOMs fail and end in divorce and almost every one here has told us that this is not the place for us (maybe not in those exact words, but that was the intent). So fine...I will come here and start posting all the positives instead of the negatives.

This is an open forum as you keep pointing out..but it is filled with very close minded people who have no interest in allowing others who have differing stories or opinions to freely express theirs! Apparently it is only open if you want to be negative and WERE in a failed MOM. Nothing I was told when I first came here was supportive. Every single reply was negative and downed my husband, who NOT ONE OF YOU KNOWS. NO one shared anything about their stories, all they did was tell me I was crazy for staying and that he was no good. That he would give me an STD and treat me like crap. Why was it wrong for me to share the link to a place that actually HAS information and stories of successful MOMs so that others who are just starting their journey can see that not every MOM ends in divorce? Every place I mentioned is already mentioned on the resources link on the main SSN page, but no one here on the forums wants to mention them? I get that not all MOMs are successful so why can't you see that there are many that are and allow us to guide others to get support for wanting to try? Not everyone who has an SSA is an insensitive jerk. Not every str8 spouse is treated like crap and given an STD. My husband did not CHOOSE to have an SSA. He fought it his entire life. He was depressed all the time. Now he is happy and accepts who he is. He isn't out sleeping around behind my back. He sexually satisfies me. We are happy together. So why not let others know that it is still possible to be happy in a MOM??

**Posted by Séan** October 10, 2016 9:16 am

Thank you everyone for your insights. I'm sorry that some of you have received poor treatment from fellow members/contributors. If I caused any harm through my own posts on this thread, please accept my sincere apologies. Depending on where we find ourselves on our own journeys, we can find ourselves in the various stages of denial, anger, resentment, acceptance etc. I agree that I can only share my personal experience with all of you. I'm a gay man who has found this community incredibly friendly and accepting. This is nothing short of miraculous because I represent 'the enemy' per se. But enough about me. I'm very interested in learning more about mixed orientation marriages so I'd encourage fellow contributors to share a bit about your relationships. I should disclose that I am a gay man who tried (and failed) to remain in a straight monogamous relationship. Unlike a lot of my gay friends, I believe that bisexual men do indeed exist and can be happily married to women. Like Kel, I believe that if both spouses agree to the terms of a relationship at the outset, a relationship based on honesty can very well succeed. But I wrongly see these kind of relationships through my own jaded lens. My marriage failed because I was trying to be something I wasn't. So I'd be very interested in hearing how MOMs have worked for any of you. Please share your own experiences.

**Posted by Kel** October 10, 2016 10:03 am

Well I, for one, plan on being more welcoming to st8 spouses, no matter where they are in their journey. My only intention here is to help, and I'll only be able to accomplish that goal if I speak in a voice that is heard. In my own life, I know that almost no advice - whether asked for or not - is taken well if it's negative. My biggest revelations have come from self-realization (usually from talking to someone) and then digesting that - NOT from hearing someone tell me what I need to do. No one needs a bossy friend - we all just need a good listener that's willing to tell you the truth when asked. I'm going to try to be that person more.

All are welcome, so long as we're being respectful to one another.

Kel

Last edited by Kel (October 10, 2016 10:03 am)

**Posted by WendiT** October 10, 2016 10:19 am

Here is a story of a couple in love who worked out all the particulars of a MOM. My male BFF is a gay man. We met after I divorced my GIDXH and I had established my new life. We bonded over a work project and found that we had many interests and hobbies in common. When I quip that being with my X was never like being with your gay best friend, my relationship with my BFF is what I am referring to.

So my BFF has another dear dear friend who is a Str8 woman. They adore and love each other and have done so for decades. They are the perfect match on every single level except that he is gay and she is straight. They have talked at length about a possible future MOM in their Golden Years in the event that neither one of them finds the love that they are looking for. They would provide all forms of companionship to each other with the exception of sex and each would be free to engage in sexual relationships outside of their MOM. This would be truly workable too because neither has any illusions of a sexual relationship with the other and they are both clear that although possible, they are not desirous of starting a family at this point in their lives. They have discussed their plans with their families, children, and friends and absolutely no one batted an eye and it was universally accepted because it just works for them.

Fast forward 7 years and the straight woman found a straight man that curled her toes and as is commonly done, the straight woman dropped my BFF as fast as a hot potato, which he lovingly accepts and gets. But that does not mean in the future, in their later years that they would not commit at that time. I think why the idea works is that they have set very clear and understandable boundaries and rules and they firmly know who they are sexually.

For me, I would have to be told up front, prior to a commitment that I was entering into a MOM for a MOM to work. Although had my XH come to me earlier on in our marriage and proposed a MOM I may have tried it in an effort to save our marriage. In hindsight I know that it would not have worked for us as I know who I am and I now know that he is incapable of such honesty and candor. It is what it is.

Last edited by WendiT (October 10, 2016 10:48 am)

**Posted by WendiT** October 10, 2016 11:03 am

Steve wrote:
Hey PS I'm curious... Is there ANYONE still on this forum (other than Sam) who remembers the name 'Portia'?

Steve, I lurked here for many years reading and getting invaluable and life-saving advice from posters such as Patti, jj, etc. I never posted because my lawyers were adamantly against any social media postings. Back then there might have been one or two posts per week as opposed to one or two per hour. I took a hiatus from SSN around the time you and your mates found the site. I was in the throws of single mom-hood and had not a minute to spare. I remember being overwhelmed and saddened by the stories of the all the new men arriving but I do remember you all to be quite spirited and lively. Years later I would return and eventually work up the courage to post. I do believe that you were the first to welcome me and urge me to share. It may have taken me another year to do so, but "thank you".

I do remember Portia who rotated aliases and funny you should mention her as a posting here recently reminded me of her. I can't for the life of me remember the name of the gent she was tracking, although I do recall he was funny and witty and quite a wordsmith. Do tell me if I am remembering that all correctly?

One last person I have been wondering about is Diff? Do you know if he is alright and what happened to him? Also tell David he is missed too. It has been boring without him.

Last edited by WendiT (October 10, 2016 11:05 am)

**Posted by JerseyGirl** October 10, 2016 11:12 am

Thank you both Sean, and Kel. If I had been greeted that way when I first came here looking for information several months ago, I'd have felt safe and welcomed.

Sean, it does take both of you to be willing to work things out. Even when the SSA spouse is willing and able to work on things, the str8 spouse is not always able to accept and stay. Even those who are willing, are not always able to compromise or experiment with their SSA spouse. I can only speak for my marriage. For us, we incorporated things in the bedroom that satisfied his SSA. In turn, he has also done more to make me satisfied.

No marriage is ever guaranteed to succeed. MOM or a straight marriage. Every marriage takes love, respect, compromise. It is just a little tougher when you are in a MOM. I do not feel like I am less of a woman. I don't feel unloved. I don't feel disrespected. As long as both partners are willing to live in a manner where they are both happy and fulfilled, a MOM can work. If his needs change in the future, we will talk it out and see if there is a compromise we can reach. Needs and wants are different things. If he truly wanted to be only with a man and live in a relationship with a man, then I would let him go and not be bitter. We are both 57 years old. Neither of us can see this changing. We are happy. We are fulfilled. We have a family and we enjoy each other's company. Sex is not a marriage. Love, respect, caring, sharing...that is a marriage and ours is strong. Bisexuals can be happily married to the opposite sex, as can Gays. It all depends on the individuals and their willingness to compromise and work at honesty in their relationship.

Last edited by JerseyGirl (October 21, 2016 2:38 pm)

**Posted by Steve** October 10, 2016 11:57 am

Hey JerseyGirl There was absolutely nothing wrong with you posting a link to Alternative Pathways. My point was that I was copping flak from Vicky for suggesting Leslie go to a closed group then you did exactly the same thing i.e. suggested people go to a closed group. I personally think people should get help WHEREVER they can find it.

Because this is a public forum there are people here who don't like MOM's. We can't stop them posting their opinions here because its a public forum and it's their opinion. Negative opinions about MOMs make it pretty hard for people trying to make a MOM work to be here sometimes.

When I see someone having a hard time here on this forum - like Leslie was - when I see them NOT getting the support they are seeking - I try to direct them to places where they WILL (hopefully) get the support they need. When I said to Leslie "this might not be the best spot for you" and directed her to the closed MOM groups on SSN that's ALL I was doing. I was trying to protect her from the negative feedback she was getting here and direct her to places where she would be better supported. I was NOT saying 'We don't want you here'.

I HOPE I have finally cleared that up.

Several times in the past this forum has been described as being like the Wild West. When you walk into this saloon ANYONE could be here. I'm sorry to say it's not (necessarily) a 'safe' place. Membership is NOT controlled although in EXTREME cases you can get blocked. In all the years I've been here (on and off) I only know of one time someone got blocked although it has probably happened more. Only Sam (Admin) knows.

If this forum does have a 'bad rep' - and I'm sure it does in certain circles - it's because it is public, open and deliberately loosely moderated. We are largely left to our own devices and expected to treat each other respectfully. Unfortunately that doesn't always happen. Some people here will - and do - act like jerks OR say things out of anger or pain that makes them sound like a jerk. It's just how it is here.

If people from highly moderated closed groups want to lurk here and 'tut-tut' over the bad things that happen here all I can say is "Welcome to the Wild West!! Hee Har!!" *shoots pistols into the air*

Sorry for another long post. Insomnia sucks.

**Posted by JerseyGirl** October 10, 2016 12:16 pm

Thank you Steve. I am sorry I got my back up :-) Explaining it as you just did made it so much clearer. I truly hope that the other post on setting up a section for MOMs is taken to heart, if there was a place for just those working on them, then perhaps those who are successfully working it out would not be so outnumbered and feel so unwelcomed. The AP website is a good source of information and links to those closed groups you speak of. Actually they are all linked to on the front SSN website page I believe. That is how I came to find them. My concern was that those who are newbies to being a str8 spouse and come to the forums are immediately inundated with all the negative posts. I found the links because I am pretty capable on the internet, but others may not be. I wanted to have feedback and not just information so I came to the forums. Had that been the only source I found (and not the link to the other groups on the main SSN page) I don't think I would be in the place I am now with my marriage. I hope that we can get more positive postings here now that the "ice has been broken" ;-)

Last edited by JerseyGirl (October 10, 2016 12:17 pm)

**Posted by Steve** October 10, 2016 12:49 pm

Thanks JerseyGirl... I'm glad we are finally understanding each other. Phew!!. I'm also glad you are thinking about hanging around and being a positive voice for MOMs or at least a voice for those trying to make a MOM work. The more diverse this community is the better in my opinion. The more diverse we are the more HELPFUL we will be.

I personally let the conservatives help the conservatives. The religious folks help the religious folks. The people dealing with transgender help the people dealing with transgender, The people dealing with a cheater help the people dealing with a cheater. Etc etc etc. It seems to work best that way. That's not to say others can't chime in but it's usually best to let people with similar experiences help

It will take all of your patience when someone wants to oppose your views. All I can advise is that you stay true to your convictions while allowing others to have theirs... however wrong you think they may be. We are ALL on our own journey. There is no 'one size fits all'.