Thanks for posting DH. I am a gay man, a former gay-in-denial (GID) husband, and now an out ex-husband. So I post from a gay male perspective. I'm not sure if my last post applies to gay-in-denial wives because from what I understand, women's communication, emotions, and sexuality are all expressed differently. Perhaps Rob or Phoenix, both straight ex-husbands, could help by posting. 

I recently read the following post from a member describing the perils of gay/straight couples therapy. Skip to the bottom if you'd like my suggestions regarding therapy. She shared: 

1. He's now claiming he was just trying to process feelings that were left over from being molested as a child by his father.  Which he never told me about until I decided to sleep on the couch instead of our bed and he realized I was serious this time. Just had a joint counseling session with my GID Husband.  Feel like I'm drowning in all this. All of the sudden since he says that his dad molested him it's all supposed to be ok...I don't get it.

As I've shared in previous posts, I'd approach any "I was molested" claim with a healthy degree of skepticism. After all, if for years your gay-in-denial husband (GIDH) has lied to you about his sexuality, internet habits, and cheating, then he might be lying again. I myself never made up such stories because I wasn't sexually abused. However, I've read about it here often enough to see a certain pattern. It appears that the "I was sexually abused" stories suddenly come up when the straight spouse is at the point of leaving her GIDH.  

2. Before the counselor met him she was sure that he had acted on his attractions. Now she is confident he hasn't just because he says so and he was molested.  I should let down my walls and help him through this. How does it change so quickly?  

This must be incredibly confusing. It sounds like her GIDH has manipulated or recruited the therapist, much like a narcissist would. With regards to the husband not acting on his same sex attraction, what the f*ck? His wife has found gay porn, Craigslist messages, and an online account through which her husband masturbated online with other men. So he's been 'acting out' for years. If jerking off online with other men isn't 'acting' then I don't know what is. And asking the straight spouse to "let down her walls" is complete bullsh*t. Did he apologize? Is there any remorse? 

3. I called him out for still not being 100% honest and she said that admitting he was looking at men at all was enough.  

The therapist is dead wrong. 

4. She did call him out when he said he wasn't sexually attracted to men.  She said you have to be attracted at least a little or you wouldn't look. Doesn't mean you are gay though.....  

Again, the therapist is dead wrong. If I'm in a bar every day getting drunk, then clearly I'm an alcoholic. My memories and past abuse aren't forcing me to drink every day. I'm responsible for making that choice. My abusive father isn't holding a gun to my head and saying, "DRINK!" The same logic applies to GIDH husbands claiming abuse. Whether the story is true or false, and it's most likely complete bullsh*t, the abusive father, uncle, brother etc. isn't holding a gun to the GIDH's head and forcing him to send lewd messages on Craigslist. That's his choice. And if he's choosing sex (whether real-life or virtual) with men over and over again, he's gay. I can only assume this therapist is a choicer: meaning her approach to homosexuality is a pathology, meaning it's learned behavior or a lifestyle choice. The therapist may also be deeply religious which means her goal is to maintain the family, at all costs. 

5. Then on the way home he said that he never rejected me for sex.  Never actually told me no.  And taking oral with nothing in return isn't rejecting....Really??? This just all sucks. How are they so good at making us feel guilty??  

This sounds a lot like a gay-in-denial narcissist trying to reframe and revise his past behaviour. Moreover, the purpose of therapy is to validate the straight wife's feelings, not make her feel worse while asking she "try harder". Again that's complete bullsh*t. 

6. Sorry just needed to vent. He's remorseful for the porn addiction, but the men he watched was only because his dad molested him not because he's sexually attracted to men.  

Remorseful how? Does this make sense: "I drink every day because of childhood abuse, not because I'm addicted to alcohol." Or: "I'm not addicted to heroin. I shoot up every day because of poor self-esteem issues." Why are we always trying to explain away homosexuality like it's treatable? If I've never really shown an interest in sex with my wife, and yet I've spent years online watching gay porn, exchanging messages with other men on Craigslist, and jerking off with men online, how am I not gay? How is this somehow my wife's fault? 

7. It's frustrating to me because I felt like I was getting stronger and more determined and now the counselor makes it seem like he's ok and now I should forgive him.  The devil is planting doubts in my head because I keep bringing it all back up....Those were her words not mine. 

Ok I get it now. The counselor is approaching therapy from a religious, rather than clinical, perspective. This likely means she'll do whatever it takes to save the marriage, rather than save the long-suffering straight spouse. I'd recommend this straight spouse see her counselor alone, and find out whether she believes homosexuality can be cured, like depression, or whether people are born gay. If your therapist is putting your gay husband and saving your marriage ahead of your own mental health, find another therapist who will focus 100% on your well-being. 

Here are my recommendations for straight spouses who have just heard "I'm attracted to men because I was abused" from their husbands. I should disclose that I believe these stories are more often false. Why? Because they follow the same pattern: he's about to lose you, panics, and makes it up. When you hear about sexual abuse, you should ask yourself: 

1. Has my husband been honest with me throughout our relationship? If not, treat this as false until proven true. 
2. Is he just trying to paint himself as the victim and get sympathy from me? Could this be emotional manipulation? 
3. Is this the first time he ever mentioned abuse? If yes, you should ask for and write down specifics because criminal charges might apply. 
4. Did he mention abuse just when you were on the point of leaving the relationship? The abuse story is often his final "hail Mary pass" to save the marriage.
5. Does the abuse claim involve an abuser you can never contact nor confront? If yes, this suggests the story might be false. If the abuser is now dead, mentally infirm, or a vague "friend" then the story might be false because you can never verify it. 
6. Is he now suggesting couples therapy? If yes, why? Clearly he needs one-on-one therapy to work through the trauma of abuse and this has nothing to do with you. 

In my opinion, the gay/straight relationship is on its last legs when the abuse stories come out and couples therapy begins. As a former gay-in-denial spouse, my #1 priority was hiding my sexuality. I didn't truly love my ex-wife. I loved my closet, porn, and secrets more. I was also a black-belt narcissist and a master manipulator who was completely incapable of appreciating my wife's suffering. As such, couples therapy was similar to what the straight spouse described above: me painting myself as the victim with my (then) wife feeling that she was responsible for our marriage's failure. This was wrong and cruel.

So what's my point? If you've just heard and an abuse sob story from your gay-in-denial husband, followed up by a push for couples therapy, here is my advice.

1. Put yourself first. The straight spouse is the victim in a gay/straight relationship so don't let anyone tell you otherwise. You should get therapy and support alone to work through your emotions. If you involve your gay-in-denial husband in your therapy, once again he'll make it all about himself. What you need is someone 100% on your side, who is completely focused on your needs and your well-being. You should also make your goals clear: namely, "I'm here because I believe my husband is gay and I'm thinking about divorce." 

2. Don't go for couples therapy. If he's a gay-in-denial narcissist, he'll just manipulate and recruit the therapist. This means painting himself as the victim, while making you feel like you need to try harder. That's bullsh*t. Why do you need to try harder to save your relationship when he: refuses to have sex with you; watches gay porn; and hooks up with men on the side? 

3. Urge him to take action: If he suggests couples therapy, ask yourself why you need to be there. Say that you're open to it, as this validates his feelings, but only after he's worked through the trauma of the alleged (and likely false) child abuse with a qualified therapist. You weren't responsible for the abuse nor were you present so you need not be present for your husband in therapy to work through the feelings. If he's claiming child abuse while at the same time suggesting couples counseling, I believe he's simply trying to position himself as a victim, rather than someone who has emotionally abused you for years...if not decades. Remember that he'll do anything to stay in the closet and this means telling lies and going the therapy. But once you're back in the relationship, the abuse, porn, and lies will continue. You should push him to go to the police to press charges against his adult abuser. Child abuse is criminal after all. If he can't provide details, balks at suggestions to get therapy and refuses to consider criminal charges, then he's probably lying. 

Some gay-in-denial husbands (GIDH) are a lot like parasites. A GIDH husband NEEDS his wife to survive and he'll do anything to keep her. This may mean going so far as to fabricate stories about child abuse, or going to therapy to give the appearance of working on your relationship. But these are all just manipulations. A leech doesn't love its host. So it's time to sprinkle salt on your leech, peel the little f*cker off, and start healing. I hope that helps in some small way my friends. Be well. 

Last edited by Séan (May 11, 2017 10:13 am)

Thank you Bec. In reply: 

1. One correction in my story just because I want to keep things honest.  I never found proof of him messaging anyone on Craigslist, only that he looked at the ads once. Not that there's not more to it, I'm sure there is but I never found proof.

Understood. Thank you for clarifying. 

2. I did tell him that I wanted to go back to individual counseling. I just keep telling him that I'm not ok and that I can't work on us until I work on me.   

I think that's a very healthy approach Bec. Good for you. 

3. Yes the councillor is coming at it from a religious perspective.  She believes that being gay is a sin and that if he repents his behaviour and ask God will take it away.   I had already told her that I didn't believe this to be true but felt like she was helping me build in myself the clarity and confidence I needed.  

Faith can be a very powerful tool. While I myself am not religious, I know that my ex-wife has been able to forgive me because of her beliefs. If your therapist's approach and beliefs help with your own healing, then by all means continue. But keep in mind that she works for you. If she's only making you feel worse, you have every right to find another therapist. 

5. It never ceases to amaze me how guilty my husband can make me feel, even when I know he's doing it. 

I'm very sorry that you're going through this Bec. You deserve better. Questions: does your gay husband feel any guilt or remorse? Has he genuinely apologized to you? I'm not a mental health professional, but I see little difference between emotional and physical abuse. The only difference is the bruising in my opinion. You're the victim here Bec, not him. So you have nothing to feel guilty about, nor should anyone make you feel like you have to apologize. 

Thanks again for sharing. 

I posted in my own thread, but, I am wondering what your response is, Sean. 

I met J in one of my college courses in college last Fall. 
He's 26, I am 33. I didn't think that anything would happen with us because of his age, but, it did. He moved in with me and things seemed good. I fell for him, hard. 
We had sex, and honestly, it's some of the best sex I have ever had. It's like he was made just for me. 
We were together for 6 months... he told me that he is bi-polar, but, not diagnosed. He is easily irritated and wants to just escape at times.... me, his life, us. 
After 6 months I looked in his phone and his computer. I found conversations between him and every type of person: female, men, transgender and/or cross-dressers.  
He swears that he never actually cheated. But, we broke up and have maintained a friendship. 
I still feel like he is "my person". He makes me laugh all the time, and I am still in love with him. I want to work things out and I still am in the belief that he will come back to me. 
When I asked him if he was gay, he said that he only entertained men because they were "easier". My thought though is that if you're willing to have sex with a man...you're gay.

Recently, he stayed with me for two weeks at my home, we slept together every night but the first night. 
He makes plans for our future, and I do too. 
He's even made comments about us having kids together. 
He gets hard around me, and in his sleep when we snuggle, which we do.. However we haven't had sex since we broke up. 
He went out with a female friend that he lost his virginity to and swore that nothing would happen with her, that nothing did happen with her. And, I believe him. 
However, I did look at his phone and found exchanges between him and various other people. He does like black girls (people?) and has almost a fetish for them. That being said, he has told me that none of those encounters in the pas have come to fruition. 
In the newest time of me looking at his phone there were attempts made by him to have sexual encounters with people (what kind of people, I am not sure).

He told me that he did have one sexual encounter with a man and that he didn't like it. That the guy went down on him. 

Some of the people he has exchanges with are "pros"... which is concerning. 

I know this is probably really piecy, but, I am just trying to find footing in all this... Help?

Thank you Sean, I am mulling over what you have said and advised. Thank you very much for your words of wisdom.

Hi forum. I read this sad post (http://straightspouse.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?id=684) from a new member named oldgot. If you can please reach out to give her your support:

1. Married 30 years. I found out my husband has booked himself in a men only gay hotel for two nights. He was going to visit his brother  for his birthday  & meet up with a friend he's not seen for 30 odd years.

​Red flags: 1. traveling alone for a birthday; 2 gay hotel; and 3. a mysterious "friend" who his wife probably doesn't know.  

2. He told me he could only get 1 bnb for a night then would switch to another. He was telling me about this but I didn't know of them since its his home town. Anyway when he was in the bath I thought I have a look see where he's staying.

Something told her he was lying so she started investigating.

3. I shouldn't have but I looked at his emails.

Don't feel the least bit guilty for snooping. Straight wives are just looking for proof. He's in the wrong. Trust your intuition.

4. We don't have anything to hide anyway. (Never have I done this before)

​Straight spouses have little to hide. Perhaps he's hiding something.

5. One of the places sounded grand. However my husband had stated his was single and included his age & that he was looking forward to it with a smiley face. This was most odd. So I looked at the website & was so shocked. Had he booked in error not knowing it's gay.

I reckon he knew exactly what he was doing.

​6. If it's men only do they supply women? Why's he state he's single when we've just celebrated our 30th wedding. Why's he single?

Probably because writing: "I'm coming without my wife because she doesn't know I'm gay" wouldn't have gone over very well.  

7. Also he had booked this as the 3rd hotel unknown to me on the day our daughters going on holiday but we would have expected him home. So I expect he would say he stayed elsewhere for another couple of nights.

More secrets, lies, and suspicions.

​8. This led me to check his history which had been cleared but not deleted. He had looked at mature big boobs. Then gay old men wanking? Then looking at craigs list  & gay pubs etc locally then gay camping holidays.. I was shocked. I tried not to say anything & couldn't stop myself. I said something like I'm sickened & shocked by what I saw. 

What a shame. If he's on Craigslist and goes on gay holidays, she should get herself checked for STDs. She should also stop having sex with her wayward husband.

9. This sort of history was just over 2 days the other history was ok. (Then he would know I've Checked his tablet..) I also had deleted the email for the gay hotel. I cried to myself feeling heart broken & distorted.

​Very sad.

​10. Anyway the next night I said if you're saying your single then let me know & Ill be single too.

Well done!

​11. When I asked if he knew it was a gay hotel he said its a retreat & I replied just be honest, where it's men only & clothing's optional & it's also famous. I asked if he's gay he said no & said he fancies women but as men have always come on to him he was a little curious.

Bullsh*t. He's lying and using a common term: curious. No straight man goes parading around a gay hotel in the nude just because he's curious. And if it's a clothing-optional hotel, that means men go there for sex...not just the stimulating conversation. Gay gay gay.

12. He also said he wasn't sure he would be brave enough to stay there.

Strange that his fears didn't keep him from: going online; looking at the website; booking a room; and exchanging emails with hotel management. I think he's more afraid of being forced out of the closet.

13. Anyway I cried he got upset & said he won't stay there. Went to bed separately but my heart was pounding I was so fraught. After a while weirdly you may think I though I would check he's ok & ask to hug him & also calm my erratic heart beat. Weirdly he said he thought his chest was hurting like he may have another heart attack.( He had one 2 years ago.)

​He's very good. He took an impossible situation and by lying about his heart, he managed to manufacture up some sympathy. And here's the proof his ticker is just fine...
​
14. I said I don't want sex just a hug for both of us. We ended up being sexual & loving & he said I'm the only one for him.

​I guess his heart was strong enough for sex.

15. Not once did he criticise me looking at his emails. He said its so weird in 30 years he's never done this & I found out & he's glad I did as it was just a curiosity that he's not actioned.

He's smooth. No this probably isn't the first time in 30 years he's done anything like this. He didn't bring up the emails because they're black & white proof that he's gay, cheating, and lying about being married.  

16. I think he should try it out as wouldn't like to think we stay together with theses feelings being repressed etc. One minute I'm ok then I'm not. It's feels worst than thinking of going with other women to me as I can't compete with a man. Your views?

Regardless of what happens, this straight spouse needs to think about her health and safety. That means being tested for STDs as soon as possible. While he may be telling the truth, once a spouse starts playing detective and posting here, there is a very good chance her husband is gay. 

​As a gay ex-husband and recovering narc, I am truly awed by this man's ability to deflect ("Was it a gay hotel?"), lie ("Oh I was just curious"), manufacture pity ("My heart!"), and manipulate (with sex no less). A gay in denial husband's #1 priority is hiding his sexuality. I'm no truthsayer, but I reckon this man has a long history of cheating and his "friend" is probably much more than that. Just a hunch.

​If you hear he words "curious" or "one-time" when it comes to behaviours that suggest your husband is gay, get yourself tested immediately for STDs. Why? As we've seen time and time again, the rule is often, "If you're investigating, he's cheating."

Be well my friends. 

Last edited by Séan (May 22, 2017 9:49 am)