Thank you for writing Shh0406. Here are links to our previous exchanges:

Post 1 link Feb 2022
Post 2 link July 2022

If you click your profile name, you should be able to search through your post history. In response to your latest update: 

1. I've been reading through these posts and I'm only on page 51. I've written to you before and asked about my boyfriend.

I remember. 

2. I can't seem to find how to get to my posts so I'm not sure if I'm asking the same questions because it was about 1.5 years ago. Ugh. He's 33 and I'm 37. We aren't married and have no children together. I have 2 of my own. Well, he finally confessed 6 months ago to being bisexual.

Understood. 

3. As I've posted before, I was looking for answers if he was gay or bisexual. I think he knew I knew and confessed. I found tons of transexual porn and subscriptions on his phone. I found text messages from a former friend that he used to spend a lot of time with where he called him sexy. I told you about his coworker and how that relationship was weird and how he moved him in etc... He now lives with me and has for past 2 years I'd say. So that was a long time ago. Well since he's told me he's bisexual we haven't had sex. Not because he's bisexual but because of the lies.

Understandable. If you suspect your partner is cheating, get tested regularly for STDs/STIs, insist that your partner get tested, and please use condoms when having sex.  

4. I feel like there's so much more to this story and he may be gay. For 6 months now I won't engage in sex with him, and he really hasn't cared. He tries sometimes and makes comments about wanting to have sex with me and on my appearance but says it's really hurting him were not having sex and it's really deteriorating our relationship. We've been to 3 couples counselors and none of them have understood or helped us because I think he's cheating, and he is in denial about it.

This sounds like a very dysfunctional relationship. Have you considered breaking up? 

5. I found grindr on his phone and he said it was from 2021 when we broke up for a couple weeks, but I go on grindr now and there is someone 1 foot away from me when were at home alone and no one else is there. Hmmm couldn't be him lol. So, I think he's still on grindr and messing around with men.

Correction. Grindr isn't for "messing around" with men. That sounds like a minimization my friend. Grindr is about men f*cking other men. Facebook and Instagram are for chatting. Bumble or Tinder are for dating. Grindr is men looking for sex with other men. 

6. He's into BDSM as I've said before and comes home with bruises on his arms sort of like a handprint that's been around his upper arm and says it's from playing basketball. He's had rug burn type marks on his shins and says it's from lifting, although he doesn't lift anything strenuous at the gym.

He's lying. If your boyfriend has admitted to being bisexual, enjoys BDSM (= bondage, discipline/domination, sadism/submission, and masochism), uses Grindr, and shows telltale signs of BDSM play, then he's clearly cheating on you...with men.  

7. I'm at my wits end Sean. I'm so over this. Every day he wants to talk but it's always the same thing. "I'm sorry I was sexting people to do BDSM stuff, I'm sorry i didn't tell you about my sexuality," but comes home with another bruise like a fingerprint and tries to hide these marks but lies and says it's from lifting or basketball.

Why are you still with this loser? What troubles me is how all of this might be affecting your children...assuming of course you all live together. Let's take a step back. Imagine you're looking for a babysitter/manny and your boyfriend applied for the position. Would you give a man with his qualifications an interview?

- Enjoys BDSM play, to the point of bruising. 
- Cheating on his (female) girlfriend. 
- Lying to his (female) girlfriend. 
- Struggles with honesty 

Why is this man even in the same space as your children? 

8. I know this isn't true. I need a therapist because as you've told these other women I'm done. I'm done being angry and I want a therapist to work on myself. The last one we had tried to transition us out of our relationship because she said I don't trust him and he's saying he's doing nothing wrong so there isn't much she can do. So were at a standstill.

I'm so sorry you're suffering my friend. Please consider how his presence and all of this conflict might be negatively impacting your children. 

9. What do you think Sean? I'm so desperate to find answers or some kind of insight and if you could do you know of any therapist I can go to in Ohio or on telehealth that can deal with my situation and betrayal trauma?

I would suggest calling "Our Path" and finding a free sponsor in your area: 1-888-651-2811 or 1-708-277-9646. You might also want to try Co-Dependent's Anonymous (coda.org) and attend free Zoom meetings. I don't think your current situation is how anyone would define love, nor how you should define love for your impressionable children.  

10. He doesn't want to go to couples therapy anymore so that's that.

He's telling you by his actions the following: "We're no longer a couple" and "I'm not going to change...ever." 

11. I'm at a point where I'm just going to work on myself and act like were roommates, I guess. I'm not budging until he admits to himself and me what he's doing, or I might give him an ultimatum like you said.

This sounds like bargaining my friend. Your first "I'm done with this relationship and his bullsh*t" message to me was in February 2022; that's 20 months ago! Clearly he's never going to tell you the truth and he's never going to move out. So what now? It's time to stop waiting for him to learn honesty and start being honest with yourself: this man is never going to change. Question: what advice would you have given yourself back in February 2022? 

12. I think you're gay and I'm done because he may never tell me.

He won't. So what action are you going to take today? 

13. Sorry, this is so scrambled. I'm tired. Thank you Sean and I appreciate you taking the time out to do this. You really have helped me so much. More than you know! 

Every straight spouse/girlfriend reaches a point where she stops looking for answers/honesty from her closeted, lying, and cheating partner. He has had 20 months (600+ days) and multiple therapy sessions to tell you the truth...and perhaps change. I think you deserve more than a sexless, dishonest relationship with a cheating, bisexual BDSM-lover. By staying in this toxic relationship, you're putting the mental health of your two (2) children at risk and also risk them defining love/relationships this way. I reckon it's time to move on.   

All shared with love my friend. Good luck! 

Last edited by Sean01 (October 25, 2023 3:03 am)

Thank you for replying Shh0406. In reply: 

1. Hey Sean, Thanks, I figured out how to look at my posts now.

Excellent. 

2. We haven't had sex in about 3-6 months as I won't have sex with him because I'm scared I'll catch something. If he is having sexual relations behind my back which we both agree he is. Like I said when you go on the Grindr app it tells you how many feet a person is next to you. When I'm at home with just him, it always says 1 foot away but he denies still having Grindr.

He's clearly lying about Grindr and Grindr is an app for gay men to arrange hookups with other gay men. Why are you still together?  

3. At this point I think it's an addiction and when men get on Grindr it's very hard to get off. They get validation, self-confidence boost, etc..Ya, the bruises [from rough sex] are ridiculous. Unless he's playing basketball and someone is squeezing his arm for longer than 10 minutes you don't get a bruise that looks like a hand print around your upper and lower arms from playing basketball. Especially when he hides them because he says I'll say he was cheating. Lol. Have you ever had men that want to do this to you? I don't understand how that can make you aroused? He likes to be called names too. Like B*tch, slut etc. If you could further explain the thought process as to why someone would like that sexually that would be great?

Does it really matter at this point? I can't answer your questions about rough BDSM sex because it's not my thing. Regardless, I think it's time to stop focusing on him and time to start focusing on yourself and your children. You've been posting here about his sexuality for about 18 months I believe. Clearly he's never going to be honest with you and with himself about his sexuality...all while continuing to cheat on you. If dishonesty and cheating aren't how you define love, it's time to separate and move on. You mentioned in previous posts that you have children. I think you and your children deserve better than him.   

4. I tried calling Our Path and had to leave a message. Do you have any websites I can refer to for counseling/therapy for betrayal trauma?

Good on you for contacting "Our Path" via telephone. For immediate, free help, I'd suggest attending a meeting with co-dependents anonymous (www.coda.org/find-a-meeting). I'd also suggest creating your own thread or perhaps posting on your existing thread asking for help to find a trauma counsellor. Again, I would urge you to kick this man out of your life. As you learned from couples counselling, it doesn't really help if your partner doesn't want to heal/change. Similarly, you won't be able to heal from his lies/betrayal if he's still living with you and you two have daily contact. It's a bit like wanting a broken leg to heal, but then re-breaking it every day. Clearly this relationship is broken and has to end. Once you two are no longer in contact, you may then begin to work on your own healing. 

5. Another question, I'm not sure if you've answered this before but do you think an individuals sexual arousal template can be opened when they watch gay porn and that's why they turn gay.

No. Gay men seek out gay porn. Gay porn doesn't turn men gay nor does it make them have sex with fellow men. We are born with our own sexualities. For example, I've never heard of anyone "turning straight" because of pornography. Gay people are just like straight people, meaning our attractions are hard-wired. 

6. I only say this because my boyfriend says his attraction to transexuals didn't develop until he was 18-19 years old. He's told me he's messed around with 4 transsexuals as well but says he isn't attracted to men just transexuals because they are women. Lol.

His attraction was likely hard-wired, although he probably didn't know that trangendered people existed until he saw them online at age 18-19. Similarly, I was always attracted to men; even from a very young age. However, I didn't know that men could have sex with men until I saw it on a screen.   

7. But I see him checking out men in public. lol I'm laughing because I'm so over this shit. You are right straight spouses go through the investigation stage, anger, grief, then their just over it. I'm at the last stage. I'll update you.

Thank you. It's perhaps time to stop investigating and start acting. You sound like you're ready to detach with love and break up with this loser. Again, I don't think this man should be around you and your kids, not because he's closeted/questioning nor because he's into BDSM. We can have different sexual orientations and identities and still be strong role models for children. I don't think this man should be around your kids because he's a dishonest cheater and you two have what sounds like a toxic and conflict-ridden relationship. Question: what advice would you give your kids if they were in similar relationships? If you would tell them to "get out" perhaps it's time to take your own advice. This man clearly isn't going to change my friend.  

8. I'm going to have to really sit and think about your questions but I'll get back to you Sean. Again, thank you for taking the time out of your day to answer these questions. We all appreciate you tremendously. 

That's very kind of you. Please keep us posted. Good luck! 

Last edited by Sean01 (October 27, 2023 3:46 am)

Sean,
I only have the one email as physical proof. He was a computer wizard so he knew how to cover his tracks. I knew it was true when I found it because it was the Piece of the puzzle that made most of my feelings and observations fit.  I always had a nagging feeling that there was Something!  He did tell me of an encounter when he was hitchhiking in the 70's with a man but didn't tell me the specifics.  I didn't think too much about it as  people were experimenting so much in the 70's.
He also never initiated sex, and even though it was good at the beginning, it always felt like a performance.  
I did always have the feeling of trying to save him although I never knew what from.  I guess that the most pronounced sign was that I had to explain how to please a woman.  I don't think most straight men would need an explanation.

Last edited by Josephine (October 30, 2023 5:19 pm)

Shh0406 wrote:

Hey Sean,
Thanks, I figured out how to look at my posts now. We haven't had sex in about 3-6 months as I won't have sex with him because I'm scared I'll catch something. If he is having sexual relations behind my back which we both agree he is. Like I said when you go on the Grindr app it tells you how many feet a person is next to you. When I'm at home with just him, it always says 1 foot away but he denies still having Grindr. At this point I think it's an addiction and when men get on Grindr it's very hard to get off. They get validation, self-confidence boost, etc..

Ok, here is my take. Bi does exist. Kind of rare in men but it does. With Bi guys it isn’t that they want either/or but that they want both. Bi guys experience strong attraction to both sexes. Gay guys are mostly to almost exclusively attracted to the same sex. Straight guys are exclusively or almost exclusively attracted to the opposite sex.  Guys tend to be very much mostly one way(gay) to very much exclusively the other (Straight) but a few are truly bisexual in that they have strong desires for both.

 I don’t buy the theory that viewing straight, or gay porn opens what one is attracted to. The first porn I ever viewed in life was straight and it seemed to fail in that manner. I was attracted to one of the guys (and not all of them) and none of the women.  I also was having homosexual attractions long before viewing that and I think the women of my dreams needs to be sued for dereliction of duty cause all the erotic dreams I can remember involved men and they turned on long before I ever actually had sex with a guy or even viewed porn. 

The difference between gay (and possibly bi men) and Straight men is that they not only desire men, but they want to be desired by men. Straight men really don’t like being liked by men.  While sex addition may be the reason why he is on Grindr, it is not the only one. As I mentioned before the other is that Bi men experience strong attraction to both men and women in my experience. I have known a few and while I cannot answer the question if a bisexual can be monogamous, I can assuredly say that they are strongly attracted to both. The other reason is on Gridr that that he wants is both a sexual relationship with you and his man/men off to the side.  Also, guys kind of want sex almost (but not always) all the time. Sure, the libido may go up or down but it does not take much to turn a guy on when they are doing what turns them on.

Ya,the bruises are ridiculous. Unless he's playing basketball and someone is squeezing his arm for longer than 10 minutes you don't get a bruise that looks like a hand print around your upper and lower arms from playing basketball. Especially when he hides them because he says I'll say he was cheating. Lol. Have you ever had men that want to do this to you? I don't understand how that can make you aroused? He likes to be called names too. Like B*tch, slut etc. If you could further explain the thought process as to why someone would like that sexually that would be great?

Some guys like verbal domination which is what that is called or humiliation. Now there is a difference between Fetish in that the guy can not function without it and simply spice. The straight equivalent might be a women abusing a guy and calling him a "Naughty Boy" or insulting him. Pain is something I don't understand but both gay and straight guys can have fantasies. If he has any homosexual desires the other guy's body and deep voice are what attracted him and if it is simply spice. If he is checking out men then Yes the guy has homosexual attractions no ifs, ands,  or buts.

Another question, I'm not sure if you've answered this before but do you think an individuals sexual arousal template can be opened when they watch gay porn and that's why they turn gay. I only say this because my boyfriend says his attraction to transexuals didn't develop until he was 18-19 years old. He's told me he's messed around with 4 transsexuals as well but says he isn't attracted to men just transexuals because they are women. Lol. but I see him checking out men in public. lol I'm laughing because I'm so over this shit. You are right straight spouses go through the investigation stage, anger, grief, then their just over it. I'm at the last stage. I'll update you.
I'm going to have to really sit and think about your questions but I'll get back to you Sean. Again, thank you for taking the time out of your day to answer these questions. We all appreciate you tremendously. 
 

As for his trans attractions, I think that is different. There are some trans people that could truly pass for the opposite sex and I think his being bi might aid in his ability' to find them attractive.  The problem with say a MTF(male to female) trans for a gay person is that the person is shall we say going the wrong way(becoming more feminine). While with a FTM they might be going the right direction(hairy, muscular, manly or boyish) but shall we say some rather important equipment could missing and this could be a deal breaker for a gay guy.

Also it is rare but gay men can have attraction to women, It tends to be weak, rare, very inconsistent. It is not surprising that some gay men admit be attracted to women. It is just that the attraction to men is much, much stronger.  

As for your lesbian friend, here is my take. She may have naturally had some attraction to women to begin with. The molestation from the uncle may have turned her off to men and then she naturally turned to what she had some attraction to.  I think molestation just causes confustion becuase the pesron never got the chance to sort it out themselves. 

I was not molested but I can think of two guys who were latter found out to be molesting boys who could have molested me given the chance. I can also think of two more that I am so grateful that that didn't do anything to an underaged and sexually inexpericnced(virgin)  teenager that was fixated on them sexually(and they knew it). I don't think a 14-15 year old guy should be doing something with men in their 20ies! Somehow I don't think that would have turned out well for me at all.  I think more likley they would have been gay and had less trouble accepting their sexuality, if they were not molested. 

Anyway the real question here is if this is a situation you can or are willing to tolerate or not.  If you value honesty this guy might come clean but I don't think he will stop the Grindr, the BDSM, the men or the transsexuals. The question is if this is something you want or not.

Last edited by Diff I guess (October 31, 2023 1:29 am)

RoseColoredGlasses wrote:

Hi, Sean and everyone else here, too!
I’m still several years in to trying to cope with my closeted, in denial - but cheating! - husband. This discussion here has been extremely helpful to me as I’ve tried to cope and chart a course for our family despite or around - circumnavigating? - the denial. It’s so hard. If you are coping with someone who is supposed to be telling you the truth, but isn’t, where does that leave you? A great piece of advice I got was: try to stay in your own reality. The thing I don’t get tho is why he’s still lying and trying to manipulate everyone into his fantasy world where he’s not gay, or at least if he is, it doesn’t count. Why? Wouldn’t it be a relief to move into one’s authentic self? Aren’t we supposed to - Jung or someone, right? As it is, I feel like Sysiphus (sp?) but I’m not the one who cheated! Just still pushing that boulder uphill…. Ugh. Anyway, the reality check here is much appreciated- thank you all!

I really believe that men who are in denial believe their own lies!  They don't want to be gay so they decide they are not.  Nothing can dissuade them from this!