Thank you for posting Blue Bear and Rob. I appreciate a variety of opinions and perspectives. It's interesting to see so many straight husbands posting in this forum about questioning/closeted lesbian wives. Obviously, as a gay ex-husband I don't get a lot of questions for straight husbands but I'd like to comment on your recent posts if I may. 

Blue Bear wrote: 

1. Just a quick reaction to Rose's question:  "Sean - question for you. And I think a lot of us are asking this, in some form - what if you still love them?"  Sean's answer is good, but I have to inject a straight partner perspective.

Feel free to post anytime my friend. 

2. This question goes to the core of the straight partner experience.  I eventually accepted that the woman I loved was a fictional character played by a skilled, Oscar-caliber actress.  The woman I loved didn't exist in the real world any more than Princess Leia, Mary Poppins, or Sarah Connor.  I never would have fallen in love with the deceptive lesbian actress in front of me, yet to whom I committed my life and with whom I had three children.

I'm so sorry that you and your children have suffered because of your ex-wife's secrets and toxic self-centredness. For me personally, the best relationship I could have with my ex-wife following divorce was no relationship; and I believe you too have chosen to go limited/no contact with your lesbian ex-wife as well. I have long maintained that some gay/straight marriages are so toxic - which was 100% my fault for lying to and deceiving my then wife - that the only solution is to separate, divorce, and then remain friendly...but not friends. I've often used the following example: the alcoholic is never going to get sober by hanging around the same bar, with the bartender acting as sobriety sponsor. The bartender/alcoholic relationship is just too fundamentally flawed. While we tried for a time to remain "friends" and have the "best divorce" possible, whenever we had extended contact I'd fall back into the same lying, minimizing, verbal abuse, and blame shifting I'd done our entire marriage. So what's my point? I believe that some gay/straight relationships are just too broken to continue. I hope that makes sense on some level.   

3. To answer Rose's question, we [straight spouses] never truly loved them [closeted/questioning spouses] because they never existed. This realization is painful, angering, and anguishing.  But it's ultimately empowering because it allows us to regain a foothold in reality and start logically plotting our path forward with the actor or actress rather than a fictional character.

These are excellent points! 

Rob wrote: 

4. Actor or actress..yes guess that is what I can think of my GX as now..she is not dead but the person walking around now is not who I married.  I don't think they deserve an Oscar though as they ultimately failed in their role..could not maintain and stay in character for a lifetime which is what they vowed to do when they married us. I remain, to this day, in character and not acting. 

Fantastic points my friend. There came a time in my coming out journey when I hated myself, hated playing the role of straight husband/father, and then wrongly tried to blame my (then) wife for "trapping" me in a role I'd willingly chosen! For a time, I tried to style myself as the victim at her hands which was so wrong. The only thing she was guilty of was marrying a closeted, dishonest, and emotionally broken husband. Eventually, I admitted my many mistakes, apologized profusely for lying to her, and realized the best thing I could do was get the f*ck out of her life. By limiting contact and/or going almost no contact, we could both stop pretending and just heal...separately.

If you want to see a divorced gay/straight former Mormon couple attempt to remain friends, follow this link to Josh and Lolly Weed's YouTube page: www.youtube.com/@laurelweed. It's instructive but oftentimes heart-wrenching, particuarly when ex-wife Lolly meets Josh's new boyfriend. 

Thank you for your excellent input straight husbands. If any straight spouses have questions for a gay ex-husband, feel free to post them here. Be well! 

Last edited by Sean01 (April 1, 2023 4:08 am)

Hi Sean and all I hope you don’t mind me popping back in to share recent events with my husband.

Last night we had an interesting conversation. I asked him why he told me he might have been masturbating to a man. He said because he thought I’d find it easier to cope with than if he was watching a woman. I told him I didn’t believe any straight man would want his wife to even imagine her husband liking men or watching gay porn. He said “well if I was gay you’d wanna help me wouldn’t you?”  I told him that I think it’s totally uncaring and disrespectful to allow me to question his sexuality with a statement like that. I flat out asked him “are you gay?” He said no with blushed cheeks. The whole time tears were pouring down my face and not once did he feel anything for me. He didn’t want to console me, just shout at me about all I’ve done wrong in the relationship. Apparently I’ve not shown him enough love or respect since we’ve had children. He told me he knows there’s better looking women than me but he loves me.

It was the first time I’ve asked him the question “are you gay” and I can’t shake the feeling that his comments back to that were strange.

Anyone else? Or I am just being paranoid like he says?

Hello Sean;

I would like to ask you a few questions to get the perspective from the LGBTQ side. I am the straight wife in the scenario. Unlike other scenarios, my gay husband was quite forthright.

I was sitting on the couch one Saturday morning, drinking a cup of coffee and waking up. He sat down beside me on the couch and said "I'm gay, I'm divorcing you". I had no idea this was coming and was completely blind sided.

There was no discussion, he was not open to talking, therapy, even taking the time to come up with a plan for separation. He said the one sentence and was then gone. We were married 20 years.

As I have moved through the mind fuck that this is, I have tried to make sense of what exactly happened.

He is adamant that he had no clue he was gay when we got married. No clue he was gay during the marriage. And that he only figured it out 2 weeks prior to telling me he was divorcing me. He stated he has not cheated, been attracted to any specific man, looked at porn, nothing.

I asked him why he blind sided me with the information and never once brought anything up in the past 20 years. He said he couldn't talk to me and he couldn't make this work. So, he made the unilateral decision to divorce me.

I waffle between empathy and disgust by his behaviour. He did not leave me in a good situation, and in fact literally just walked away from his entire life. Just took his clothes and one of the tvs. Left me with 5 pets to take care of, a half renovated house to deal with, and no money.

In an effort to try to understand his side of this, I have asked him to please explain some things. We slept together for 20 years (consistently, without issues) and that only changed about a month before his announcement. He never mentioned anything. He complimented me etc. Here I was happy and making future plans.

So, I have not ever struggled with my sexuality. So, I honestly don't know how this works. He states he was in denial until he had his gay epiphany 2 weeks before leaving. He said he was able to have sex with me because of his denial right up until the end. All of these revelations have been great for my self esteem *eye roll*. He has basically said a lot of incredibly cruel and hurtful things that I really wish he had kept to himself.

I am curious, in your opinion, is this plausible? 

I mean, I don't feel particularly great to be told that it took 2 whole weeks to end our 20 year marriage without even bothering to talk to me.

Thank you for the reply.

You are correct, I didn't dive into the entire bi revelation in 2020 because I did not want to write a book. He did come out as bi in 2020. At this time I was as supportive as I was able to be. I did a lot of research into LGBTQ, what this meant, even met with a sex therapist and reviewed sexuality etc. I told him to take all the time he needed to decide if he wanted to remain in the relationship. He went to a therapist. I was clear and open about all boundaries.

I told him flat out that he needed to figure himself out and what he wanted. That if the relationship didn't work for him, to tell me and we would work out an amicable divorce. Several months passed, and he sat down with me and basically begged me to stay. He cried. Told me how much he loved me. How committed he was and that he was in this for the long haul.

So.....stupidly, I stayed. I believed him....and I made a lot of changes in my life. I worked on rebuilding trust. I went to therapy. I looked at my own hang ups, and dived into reworking my own attraction (because I do not find 2 men having sex a turn on, I am most definitely straight). 

I asked him to do one thing. I said, if he had any doubts. If he was confused. If he found himself still questioning his sexuality, that he had to talk to me, and we had to work this out together. Because we are a partnership. I also asked him point blank if he thought it was possible he was gay. I told him my fear was that, years from now, he would sit me down and slap me in the face with "I'm gay and I want a divorce" (it's like I had super power foresight there.....)

By not bringing it up in our 20 years of marriage, I meant to say that he was adamant he was not gay and that he had a strong attraction to me. Again....the fact that he slept with me the entire time, I didn't question this. So, I figured he was actually bi. And that he had committed to our marriage and wanted to remain with me. To be honest, I'm a neophyte in the LGBTQ world, so I honestly didn't know how the bi thing worked. Not gonna lie, I don't understand being attracted to both sexes, but all the therapists, my friends, people I talked to, and him, assured me it was a real thing. So. I believed that he was bi.

So, I made my boundaries clear. The main one was, if you return to this marriage you are making a commitment. You are promising to me that if anything changes, you will talk to me. And I told him that he would ruin me as a human being if he sat down beside me one day and said "I'm gay, I'm leaving". I laid it all out, I said that I absolutely could not do that. This was non-negotiable. I thought I had protected myself. I thought I had a committed husband. He said all the right things.

Turns out, they were all lies.

He remains adamant that he only figured it out 2 weeks before telling me. And he has said that he understands that I don't believe him, but it is true. That he realizes now he was in such deep denial. So, I guess he's telling me he faked being a straight man???

His exact response when I asked why there was a change was "I think it was gradual within the last year and a bit and I only realized it within those two weeks. I know that is hard to hear and I am sorry."

I feel like this is bullshit. And the very fact that he did exactly what he promised not to do, and left in such a cruel and heartless way makes him the very definition of an abusive asshole. He positively hates it if I say that what he did was domestic abuse, but news flash, he psychologically tortured me and destroyed my life.

Thank you for confirming what I had figured. That he's a pathetic coward, a user, and a manipulative asshole.

Now, I have to come to terms with the fact that I married this person and stayed with him for 2 decades. Because I feel so much humiliation, shame and embarrassment. 

For the record his family is incredibly supportive and have already told them how much they love and accept him (his entire family dumped me). He has a brother who is bi and in a polyamorous marriage. And zero religion in his life ever.

Last edited by Anon2222 (April 19, 2023 5:48 pm)

Thank you for writing Anon and Lily. In reply: 

Anon wrote: 

1. Thank you for the reply. You are correct, I didn't dive into the entire bi revelation in 2020 because I did not want to write a book. He did come out as bi in 2020. At this time I was as supportive as I was able to be. I did a lot of research into LGBTQ, what this meant, even met with a sex therapist and reviewed sexuality etc. I told him to take all the time he needed to decide if he wanted to remain in the relationship. He went to a therapist. I was clear and open about all boundaries. I told him flat out that he needed to figure himself out and what he wanted. That if the relationship didn't work for him, to tell me and we would work out an amicable divorce. Several months passed, and he sat down with me and basically begged me to stay. He cried. Told me how much he loved me. How committed he was and that he was in this for the long haul.

Thank you for clarifying. As I've shared in countless posts and also in my "Our Path" podcast interviews, defining your husband's sexuality can often feel like an emotional black hole. However, "liar" is a pretty black and white term; meaning you're either telling the truth or lying. Before asking a husband, "Are you gay?" I urge straight wives to first determine where their husbands are on the honesty scale with regards to his sexuality: 10/10 is completely honest; 5/10 is somewhat honest; and 0/10 is completely dishonest. If your husband lied for decades about his attraction to men, lied about his gay porn habits, and lied about cheating with men, then he is constitutionally incapable of honestly answering the question: "Are you gay?" 

2. So.....stupidly, I stayed. I believed him....and I made a lot of changes in my life. I worked on rebuilding trust. I went to therapy. I looked at my own hang ups, and dived into reworking my own attraction (because I do not find 2 men having sex a turn on, I am most definitely straight). I asked him to do one thing. I said, if he had any doubts. If he was confused. If he found himself still questioning his sexuality, that he had to talk to me, and we had to work this out together. Because we are a partnership. I also asked him point blank if he thought it was possible he was gay. I told him my fear was that, years from now, he would sit me down and slap me in the face with "I'm gay and I want a divorce" (it's like I had super power foresight there.....)

I don't think it's stupid to want to believe the man you married and to work like hell to make your relationship work. Where things go wrong, however, is believing that a questioning husband is capable of being honest about his sexuality. As I shared in my podcast interviews, letting your questioning husband drive the relationshiop bus is a bit like nervously watching Stevie Wonder take the wheel. As a blind man, no matter what he says Stevie Wonder just can't drive. Similarly, men who since childhood have lied to themselves and others about their attraction to men simply cannot be honest about it, particularly when their wives are asking, "Are you gay?" This is why so many questioning/closeted men blame their attraction to men on sexual abuse or they claim to be bisexual.   

3. By not bringing it up in our 20 years of marriage, I meant to say that he was adamant he was not gay and that he had a strong attraction to me. Again....the fact that he slept with me the entire time, I didn't question this.

Thank you for clarifying. 

4. So, I figured he was actually bi. And that he had committed to our marriage and wanted to remain with me. To be honest, I'm a neophyte in the LGBTQ world, so I honestly didn't know how the bi thing worked. Not gonna lie, I don't understand being attracted to both sexes, but all the therapists, my friends, people I talked to, and him, assured me it was a real thing. So. I believed that he was bi.

I'm gay with zero attraction to women so I don't have first-hand experience with bisexuality, nor do I have any bisexual friends. That said, I do believe in the sexual spectrum meaning people can be straight, gay, bisexual, or anything in between. 

5. So, I made my boundaries clear. The main one was, if you return to this marriage you are making a commitment. You are promising to me that if anything changes, you will talk to me. And I told him that he would ruin me as a human being if he sat down beside me one day and said "I'm gay, I'm leaving". I laid it all out, I said that I absolutely could not do that. This was non-negotiable. I thought I had protected myself. I thought I had a committed husband. He said all the right things.

Smart. I applaud you for setting boundaries, namely monogamy. 

6. Turns out, they were all lies. He remains adamant that he only figured it out 2 weeks before telling me. And he has said that he understands that I don't believe him, but it is true. That he realizes now he was in such deep denial. So, I guess he's telling me he faked being a straight man??? His exact response when I asked why there was a change was "I think it was gradual within the last year and a bit and I only realized it within those two weeks. I know that is hard to hear and I am sorry."

Again, I think you're asking Stevie Wonder to drive the bus. Your husband is constitutionally incapable of being honest with you, with himself, and with others when talking about his sexuality. So the new rule is: when his mouth is moving and he's talking about his sexuality, he's lying. So no I don't think he magically turned gay in a two-week period. As I shared in my last post, the common journey for gay men who marry women is: first felt an attraction to boys around age 5/6; married a female "best friend" to conform; starts exploring his sexuality online through gay porn; and inevitably cheats with men. So no, I don't believe him.    

7. I feel like this is bullshit. And the very fact that he did exactly what he promised not to do, and left in such a cruel and heartless way makes him the very definition of an abusive asshole. He positively hates it if I say that what he did was domestic abuse, but news flash, he psychologically tortured me and destroyed my life. Thank you for confirming what I had figured. That he's a pathetic coward, a user, and a manipulative asshole.

Agreed!

8. Now, I have to come to terms with the fact that I married this person and stayed with him for 2 decades. Because I feel so much humiliation, shame and embarrassment. For the record his family is incredibly supportive and have already told them how much they love and accept him (his entire family dumped me). He has a brother who is bi and in a polyamorous marriage. And zero religion in his life ever.

I'm so sorry you're struggling my friend. With regards to your in-laws, divorcing your husband often means divorcing your in-laws as well. I think it's common for in-laws to circle the wagons around their sons during the divorce process. Sadly, this means cutting ties with a future ex-daughter-in-law. It sucks, but it happens. 

Lily wrote: 

1. Quoting Anon: "I also have that fear - that a bi person is just lying to themselves and is really gay - but all the therapists I have talked to say this is not true. That a person who is truly bi (and not lying to themselves) does not progress to becoming gay. That only those who are not being honest about it do (and they knew already they were gay, just didn't want to accept it)." Hi Sean, nice to hear from you. I don't agree with the therapist though.  Do you really believe there are bisexuals that do not progress to becoming gay?

Sorry for the confusion. I should have edited Anon's quote to read: 

"I also have that fear - that a bi person is just lying to themselves and is really gay - but all the therapists I have talked to say this is not true...That only those who are not being honest about it do (and they knew already they were gay, just didn't want to accept it)." Agreed! 

In response to your question, yes I believe sexuality exists on a spectrum. Using my own life experience as an example, I am a gay man with zero attraction to women, my long-term (gay identified) boyfriend still feels some physical attraction to women, and both of my brothers-in-law are 100% straight. I personally believe my sexuality (gay) has always been hard-wired...just like the countless heterosexuals in my life. However, my ability to accept my sexuality, openly live my sexuality, and share about it with others is/was environmental. The less accepting the country, city, family, or religious community, the more I felt a need to lie about, hide or minimize my sexuality. So no I don't believe bisexuals can morph into gay people, but I do believe a lot of closted gay husbands claim they are bisexual as a sort of interim step to fully coming out.   

2. And if you do believe there is such a thing as a lifelong bisexual, not just someone on the way to becoming fully gay, can you give me a bit of a description of such a person please.

Nope! You'd have to ask a self-identified bisexual man that question. As a gay man with no physical nor sexual attraction to women, I can't pretend to understand the bisexual experience. 

3. Because it seems to me that two bisexuals of the same sex would do better as a couple than when they are opposite sex. And if I could hire a sky sign for a day it would say a straight needs a straight! 100%.

Uknown. I reckon it's the lies and dishonesty that kill these relationships. I have known I was gay since childhood, lied to my (then) wife/girlfriend to conform, neglected/abused her for years, and then summarily dumped her when I finally accepted my lifelong attraction to men. I hope beyond hope we're moving towards a time when people can be completely honest with themselves and others about their sexualities. Had I been completely honest with my (then) girlfriend about my attraction to men before we married, she probably would have moved on and married a straight man. By lying to her - as Anon's husband did when he (a gay man) claimed to be bisexual - I robbed her of that choice. 

If any straight spouses have questions for a gay ex-husband. Feel free to post them here. Be well! 

Last edited by Sean01 (April 20, 2023 12:06 am)