OurPath (formerly SSN) Open Forum / I’m not ok

**Posted by Epiphany** January 11, 2021 3:58 am

This is the 3rd time in the past week I’ve been up for hours, crying in the middle of the night. In 2009 I discovered some of my husband’s infidelity. Some of it with a woman, but found emails with a man and learned he had kissed a man at a gay bar. I knew he was bisexual in our younger days but he told me those feelings were gone (at the time we married), and that he thought it was a stage. There’s a lot of details to our story but I’m just going to fast forward to current day. Last week I found a KY jelly receipt, he claims it was a work prank gift for Christmas, could be true. It led me to asking for his phone. He did not give it to me till going in the bathroom for 5 minutes. I still found a message he sent to another man, calling him sexy, trying to start a conversation (he forgot to delete 1, I think because the guy was unresponsive).

Today I talked to him. I shared that I needed honesty, I asked more questions. I asked what he deleted and he finally admitted that it was Facebook messages, sexual pictures they would send back and forth. Later I looked at his friends list and took screenshots of every man he has no other friends in common with. I’m not sure if there is a private Bi-curious group but I probably will ask him how he found them all at one point. I asked him if he has had sex with anyone else during our marriage, he said no. I asked if he had oral sex with anyone else during our marriage, he just stared at me. I said who? And started naming people. He finally said, a guy he met at a bar while traveling when he was 26 (so 14 years ago before our son was born). I asked him if he feels like his attraction is stronger for men sometimes and women other times. He said yes. I asked if he felt more attracted to men right now and he said yes. Those were the biggest discoveries. I was crying, he seemed pretty ok. He then gave me a hug and said “we’ll get through this”. He knows I want monogamy. He said he wants it to stop, his desires. (I know he can’t make it stop). We are planning to go to counseling.

I’m here right now though because I’m a bit shocked at my physical reactions right now. I can’t sleep. I’m crying. Racing thoughts between “we will take this slow, we will be ok” to “we are NOT going to be ok. How will I tell my parents. How will we tell our kids”. I’m worried about what this might do to my already sensitive 12 year old son and 2 older daughters that are both in counseling rn (their cousin, our nephew...accidentally shot himself in September, he was only 13). I don’t know how I will support myself...the last two jobs I had were in childcare and retail and I made 8.50 an hour. I have no degree. I honestly can’t stand this right now. The unknowns. Will he be able to stop the cheating (at this point I’m only aware of virtual and he’s deleting those men), can we do something in the bedroom to help him. Does he really love me like he says? How can he love me if this is what he’s doing? What do I still not know?

I know I need counseling but it’s his flippn’ 40th birthday this week. We are flying to Vegas (I have Covid antibodies, don’t panic) to celebrate with another couple and his sister (whose son passed). He is acting so ok but I’m just falling apart. I don’t know if he thinks this is like the last 2 times I learned something and doesn’t see that I’m having an “epiphany” or if he just doesn’t care as much. I’m scared. I really don’t know who I am if I’m not his wife, I guess I’ve lost myself over the years. I don’t want our family life to end though. I hate this, I didn’t ask for it and I’m not sure I’m going to be ok right now. Any survival tips are appreciated. Anything from what I need to do to protect myself in divorce to how this might work in the end. Most of all, I think I just needed to “talk”. Thank God for this group right now.

Last edited by Epiphany (January 11, 2021 4:02 am)

**Posted by inkundermyskin** January 11, 2021 7:22 am

i wish sorry was enough for you. i wish i could hug you. so many times i've needed to hold someone and let the tears fall. all i can say, is to just TRY to breathe deeply. the tears will fall regardless. TRY not to focus on what was there in the past. try to just be in the now, even if its just an hour at a time. your fears of the tangibles are warranted. the unknowns are part of tomorrow. again, just try to focus on today, and when the tears pass at different times, it will be easier to think of tomorrow and the unknowns. i am not a religious person at all, but i had someone tell me that god only gives the hardest battles, to his toughest warriors. you are a beautiful, yet hurt woman. you have weathered this off and on for years. you've given birth and raised kids. as much as i still hurt, i'm alive as you are. im better today than i was 10 months ago and 10 days ago. i don't know if its about getting easier as it is accepting and adapting to this new life we have been handed.

**Posted by Leslie77** January 11, 2021 9:10 am

Epiphany, I am sad for you and what you are going through. There are people here who will listen and support you.

I've been on this forum for exactly one year. I found it after two years of escalating revelations about my cross-dressing, gay in denial husband. We are no longer married.

One of the take-aways from the many posts I've read is this: Most of us started the journey with weird discoveries and nagging doubts that grew in concern as time passed. Also, there are couples who make it through this but they seem to be in the minority.

I totally agree with longwayhome - couples counseling at this time is probably not your best option. I tried that and it caused me additional trauma. The first thing I would recommend to you is to find a competent counselor for yourself. Also, it helps to talk to a trusted friend or relative. I kept silent for two years and it ate me alive. You might also want to try journaling. Write about what is bothering you and why. It may be helpful as time passes to reflect on your writing so you can see that what you experienced was real.

Regarding divorce - I've been through it twice and in my experience, the courts are not concerned about who did what to whom or why. In both cases, the bottom line was money. You want to protect yourself financially. Starting immediately, I would suggest that you document everything you can related to family finances, your husband's earnings and pensions, bank accounts - those known to you and possible secret accounts and/or safe deposit boxes. Keep a careful eye on what happens with money. You might want to consult with a lawyer.

You might want to re-think your trip to Las Vegas. I was supposed to go away with my husband at one point on a "couples trip" when we were in serious trouble and I am forever grateful I cancelled. It may be hurtful for you to pretend in front of other people that everything is fine when it's not. You can always blame COVID.

I hope and pray you will be okay and please continue to post here.

**Posted by Daryl** January 11, 2021 9:28 am

It seems to me that the person most in need of counseling is your spouse. If he values your relationship and really wants to get through it, this shouldn't be met with an objection. Just a little food for thought.

**Posted by Stronger** January 11, 2021 9:44 am

Epiphany, so much of your story sounds like mine... and the initial reactions of being up and crying and tossing between everything will be alright and the world is falling apart... take time for yourself and expect lots of emotions. The birthday will be hard but you will find you can put a smile on and act the part. Give yourself some time before and after any “command performances” in case you need to crumble.

I was late to getting counseling for myself and I wish I had started sooner. Meanwhile, this is a great group of people who understand all of the highs and lows as your sort out your new reality.

**Posted by Rob** January 11, 2021 11:22 am

Before replying to Epiphany here I first want to make the comment to everyone that these spouses/ex spouses never cease to amaze me..they have one other thing in common; they put us all in therapy..we need therapy, kids are in therapy, dog is in therapy..but they themselves are fine and very happy feeling they need no therapy themselves.

Epiphany,

I think are feeling first the distrust and anxiety of a gay and lying spouse.
You are also feeling the great number of worries and problems of the future if you leave him. I know the feeling as I am a constant worrier.

Know that you don't need to figure everything out in a day. Important thing is to give yourself a break.
If this birthday/trip/his lies is stressing you than maybe cancel ..tell him why. Do not feel guilty or ashamed..he created the anxiety and stress you feel..not you. Its not you.

Start small building support for yourself. Maybe ask him what proofs he can give, if he says good morning, that he is telling the truth.. this is his problem that you are not required to solve. I only started gaining control when I realized all the problems were not mine to solve.

Build your support system..God knows we need help.

Last edited by Rob (January 11, 2021 3:19 pm)

**Posted by ThisTooShallPass** January 11, 2021 12:25 pm

I remember the thought of realizing I had lost myself. I have basically spent my entire adult life with this man....and now this?

Survival tips? It's ok to cry. It's ok to be angry, or sad, or mourn the marriage you thought you had. I remember having vidid dreams for weeks, and waking up with panic attacks. The one where I was wandering around alone and lost in abandoned building still haunts me. Journal, come here to talk, find someone (trusted family or friend) to confide in. My panic attacks decreased significantly when I confided in my sister. An individual therapist, one who deals with trauma probably, is better for you. You two can decide to deal with couples counseling in the future once you've worked out what you need from each other--whether you decide to move forward together or figure out how to separate and find closure.

I agree that you don't have to make all the decisions right now. My husband's therapist told him "don't make emotional decisions, it always ends badly." He reiterated baby steps to him, and to both of us when I joined a couple sessions. My therapist told me something similar--it's ok to go slow.

As for the trip, don't go if the idea stresses you out. If you're willing to put on a happy face or think the distraction might help, then consider it. I was blindsided in March with "I'm attracted to men..." and immediately cancelled our trip home to visit his family for Easter. (We had just moved away for his job a few months prior.) We blamed covid of course. We did end up visiting in August, and it was difficult to "pretend" but it was also my son's birthday week and I didn't want any drama. I don't think I could have done it in those first few months.

If divorce is a serious consideration for you, it's ok to reach out for some legal consultations. Many will offer one for free or reduced cost. They can give you an idea on what to expect in terms of splitting assets and debt, custody, child support, and you may be entitled to spousal support. You don't have to do anything with the information right now. Just having the information is one baby step.

I am still in the limbo stage - I have not formally started divorce proceedings, but we both know deep down it's probably coming. He has "struggled to label his sexuality" though the underlying implication was originally that he was gay, so I think "struggling" and dropping the word bisexual occasionally is not a legitimate struggle with sexuality, but rather backpedaling because he's scared of divorce, coming out, etc. I'm scared of being a single mother, starting over alone for the first time in my life. So we're both kind...stuck in neutral? I just take it one day at a time, doing one little thing for myself. Open a checking out. Read a book for myself. Get a credit card in my name only. Make a bucket list. Update my resume. Get my hair done. Sometimes the step is practical, sometimes it's pampering and self-serving. Just...something....

I read somewhere that if you are unsure about divorce, to work on "finding yourself" and see if your spouse joins you on the journey...either way, you will have a better understanding of yourself and know what you like and want in your marriage OR in your single life. I think those of us dealing with sexual orientation have a whole other beast to confront, but it's still practical advice. I thought I was lonely because of my husband, but like you...I also feel like I've lost myself. Maybe if I start finding myself now, I won't be as lonely as a single person as I am now as a woman who as lost herself in a hopeless marriage.

**Posted by Ellexoh_nz** **Online!** January 11, 2021 2:56 pm

My comments in red

Epiphany wrote:
This is the 3rd time in the past week I’ve been up for hours, crying in the middle of the night. I think all in all I spent all of 2012 to 2018 crying, not only in the night but the day as well In 2009 I discovered some of my husband’s infidelity. Some of it with a woman, but found emails with a man and learned he had kissed a man at a gay bar. At one point I was looking through my partners phone.. It just made things worse. I was so glad when I could tell myself these were his choices not mine and finally simply stopped looking. He used to delete his phone messages at the end of every day, and tell me he didn't like clutter. I knew he was bisexual in our younger days but he told me those feelings were gone (at the time we married), and that he thought it was a stage.I knew my partner was bisexual and thought it was a part of OUR sex life. What a fool I was! There’s a lot of details to our story but I’m just going to fast forward to current day. Last week I found a KY jelly receipt, he claims it was a work prank gift for Christmas, could be true. It led me to asking for his phone. He did not give it to me till going in the bathroom for 5 minutes. I still found a message he sent to another man, calling him sexy, trying to start a conversation (he forgot to delete 1, I think because the guy was unresponsive). A man can delete a lot of emails in 5 minutes. But yeah we can tell when something sits out of place within the 'norm'. In the first 24 hrs after leaving for holiday my partner had googled sex shops and a website Locanto that seems to have taken over Craigslist. Wasting no time he'll no doubt have made a profile, taken pictures, and be chatting etc with other men. I don't for a minute believe he won't be chatting with women too

Today I talked to him. I shared that I needed honesty, I asked more questions. I asked what he deleted and he finally admitted that it was Facebook messages, sexual pictures they would send back and forth. Later I looked at his friends list and took screenshots of every man he has no other friends in common with. I’m not sure if there is a private Bi-curious group but I probably will ask him how he found them all at one point. I asked him if he has had sex with anyone else during our marriage, he said no. I asked if he had oral sex with anyone else during our marriage, he just stared at me. I said who? And started naming people. He finally said, a guy he met at a bar while traveling when he was 26 (so 14 years ago before our son was born). I stopped getting answers to MY questions when I stopped asking them. The questions I used to ask him got him angry and for a man I knew inside and out I knew the anger was a cover-up. I asked him if he feels like his attraction is stronger for men sometimes and women other times. He said yes. I asked if he felt more attracted to men right now and he said yes. Those were the biggest discoveries. I was crying, he seemed pretty ok. He then gave me a hug and said “we’ll get through this”. He knows I want monogamy. My partner knows I want monogamy too. But I think he's gone too far down the hole of secrecy to get his bisexual desires met to ever be totally honest about it. He said he wants it to stop, his desires. (I know he can’t make it stop). We are planning to go to counseling. It's much easier for a man whose been caught out to tell the woman who caught him out...an untruth.
I don't believe counseling does any good for men whose sexual preference is for men. Mine thought the counselor we saw was just 'out to get him'.

I’m here right now though because I’m a bit shocked at my physical reactions right now. I can’t sleep. I’m crying. Racing thoughts between “we will take this slow, we will be ok” to “we are NOT going to be ok. How will I tell my parents. How will we tell our kids”. I’m worried about what this might do to my already sensitive 12 year old son and 2 older daughters that are both in counseling rn (their cousin, our nephew...accidentally shot himself in September, he was only 13). I don’t know how I will support myself...the last two jobs I had were in childcare and retail and I made 8.50 an hour. I have no degree. And there you are.....wondering if everybody else is okay but telling nobody you're not. This will make you even stronger than you actually are because it's a monumental thing you're carrying around while still being a mother. And you'll know when it's the right time to tell people, because you can't carry this burden around in silence forever, which is what your husband wants you to do. The first person I told was my older daughter. She was 34 at the time and has been one of the rocks I depend on. I honestly can’t stand this right now. The unknowns. Will he be able to stop the cheating (at this point I’m only aware of virtual and he’s deleting those men), can we do something in the bedroom to help him. Does he really love me like he says? How can he love me if this is what he’s doing? What do I still not know? There you are again being Mother Hen worrying about...hey he's not your chick! He's a grown man. His cheating isn't your problem to solve it's his. As for the bedroom...again he's the one who should be doing all he can to assuage your fears, and anyway this is not a sexual thing.....it's what is going on in his head too. My partner could satisfy me then head off to a man (yuck) not that he can, we haven't had sex in a year (my answer to his silence about all this). The sooner you realise it doesn't matter what you still don't know, if he wanted you to know he'd tell you so why keep that 'not knowing' in your head?

I know I need counseling but it’s his flippn’ 40th birthday this week. We are flying to Vegas (I have Covid antibodies, don’t panic) to celebrate with another couple and his sister (whose son passed). He is acting so ok but I’m just falling apart. Course he's acting okay....because you're going to act okay while you fly off and give your compassion to a woman who has lost her child. I don’t know if he thinks this is like the last 2 times I learned something and doesn’t see that I’m having an “epiphany” or if he just doesn’t care as much. I’m scared. The longer I kept finding clues, then let him convince me it was nothing....the longer he kept me weak, and I would tell myself I had nowhere to go...no way of providing for myself. We'll be okay. I really don’t know who I am if I’m not his wife, I guess I’ve lost myself over the years. I don’t want our family life to end though. I hate this, I didn’t ask for it and I’m not sure I’m going to be ok right now. Any survival tips are appreciated. I've been through all the uncertainty you've described, the losing of oneself is so wrong but more that you've lost yourself within the ones you love Anything from what I need to do to protect myself in divorce to how this might work in the end. Honestly you have to harden your heart first, but I don't mean in a harsh way. Start by putting your children's welfare above your husbands. He can look after himself....AND have a bit of cake on the side too. Most of all, I think I just needed to “talk”. Thank God for this group right now.

Elle
( I didn't set out to type so long an answer!!)

**Posted by Epiphany** January 11, 2021 3:00 pm

Thank you everyone for all of your responses. I was not aware of the counseling situation, with couples therapy being an issue sometimes. I was hoping to find a counselor we could each go to alone and then together. This morning my husband said that he thought I was maybe thinking this was way worse than it was. I said I don’t know, I don’t know what you’ve all done or for how long. Obviously I married him knowing he had experimented in the past..so when little things started happening I wasn’t as shocked but more betrayed. He had been my best friend forever. Why couldn’t he talk to me about this like he used to? I told him twice, under 2 different instances that I just need him to loyal to us. I told him if he had desires to talk to me and we could incorporate it into our intamacy. He never did though and claims that I haven’t acted “in love” with him in years. I don’t really understand though because I got past the hurt and pain, believed he was having ED issues and was waiting patiently for him to go to the Dr. he still says he thinks he should. Somebody mentioned that my husband sounded like he needed counseling. I agree and he is agreeing to go. When we spoke yesterday, he said he’s been reflecting “trying to figure out what’s wrong, wanting the thoughts to stop”. He told me today that I’m not a cover, that he’s in love with me. However when I asked if he was more attracted to men currently (going back and forth through the years as an in denial Bisexual), he said yes. He said it’s sexual though and doesn’t want relationships. I explained that could change if he developed an emotional connection. So I’m so confused. I did finally get some sleep which helped. I think I’m going to try and stop digging until after Vegas. I don’t want to ruin his birthday and I do think it might be good. There will be no intimacy so no worries. I’ve decided that’s not happening for awhile and probably will ask him to be tested for STD’s if we decide to try and move forward. I am going to look into counselors, investigate our finances a bit, try to figure out the alimony I might receive etc...I did tell him though, even if we cannot fix us, I’m not looking for an immediate divorce. Our son has 5 years of school left. I’m not ready to end our family life as we know it. I agree that I need to take a little time and get stronger. I like the advice of doing at least 1 thing a day for myself. I appreciate you all. Thank you!!

**Posted by LostAtSea** January 11, 2021 10:17 pm

I feel for you! We are all going through the same thing of deceiving spouses from their lies and betrayal. Causing us havoc on our bodies and trauma to our hearts and minds.

Here's what I have learned, if it will help you any.....

I am 1 month and 13 days from the "phone call" that rocked my world! I was crying, yelling, screaming, panic attack, not eating, not sleeping, etc. I was on a emotional roller coaster or a freight train and literally was going insane. A few days later, I am sympathetic and feel sorry for my best friend's "cries and tears" of sorrow. about being lost in the word. And why did God create a monster to hurt the only person who has every loved him. Then I think okay maybe we can stay married even if he is transfemale that now desires men. We were still going to have an amicable divorce and even thought about not officially divorcing, but living separate lives. We would still "remain in each other's lives" because only we knew what we meant to each other besides what others thought. We were best friends and soulmates.

I too thought maybe if I changed things in the bedroom it might work. After about 3 weeks of back and forth hell of emotions, questioning why I didn't know about his new "trans and now men desires", why he didn't tell me etc. We finally brought up if these new "desires" to be with men are so strong since he wants to be female and to see what it feels like. This is the only time he decided to "stay" and to asked if he could "come home".

I too felt bad that I missed his 45th birthday and have never missed one in 16 years. I even wished him a happy birthday and to blow out candles to figure out who he was in this life. I was still being a good spouse and partner. I even texted his mom to be sure he had a cake and to have a good time.

All of this "standing" by my partner so he wouldn't be lost in this world changed last week. He was sexting with men and hiding money and stealing to buy prepaid cards to get on adult sites to pay to hook up with men. He was deleting items and didn't think I would uncover it.

I literally just got off the phone with him. We are using a mediator for our divorce (I am still being nice to not drain the bank account). Now, this divorce is going to be war. At first the tells me he wants to be sure I never have to worry about money, he would cover my bills. NOW because I discovered all this sexting pics he's not being nice anymore. He said I wish you would have just left it as I was talking to men on line. I didn't know the conversations or pics since he deleted, but I retrieve all these pictures and text messages from his cell phone. All of a sudden giving me money, he's going poor. He just wants money for this HRT to transition to female and that's why he's not nice anymore. He gave me a dollar amount begrudging. He said I thought we were going to be amicable. I said that went out the window when you lied again about texting men. I packed up all his belongs yesterday. Every pic, every card, everything and said come pick it up. This felt so good to me!

I know that God had given me lots of signs, but I didn't listen. I won't accept behavior that I don't do to others. Now I know my true value and worth! I DESERVE BETTER!

My advice:
It's okay to be emotional and cry. I know it's hard to sleep or eat. Try to buy easy food that requires less cooking (fruit, pre-made meals). Maybe order take out so save yourself the hassle and be less stressed on you and your kids. Be kind to yourself. I lost 12 lbs in one month not eating.

If you want to go celebrate his birthday, do so because you want to. I did support my spouse even looking for therapist etc b/c he was my best friend too. Everyone thought I was crazy, but if you feel that's what you need.

Please try to plan counseling for yourself. I did 1 couples counseling and thought the therapist was good, you need someone for yourself. Remember to take care of YOU!

It's nice when it's all love, until a divorce and now it's WAR. Try to talke to lawyers or mediators for your financial position. You will get child support and alimony.

As far as losing yourself, I felt the same. I really need to find "me" again and know my purpose. All I have done was take care of him for 16 years, and look what he did to me. Take it one day at a time about discovering yourself.

Then when you "wake" up with enough evidence and KNOW what YOU WANT, you can plan it all.

Stay Strong! And be sure to take care of you so you can take care of your children.