Posted by Séan October 10, 2016 12:52 pm | #81 |
All I can write is WOW! Thanks Jerseygirl for so openly and courageously sharing your story. That took guts my friend. There are a number of things I admire in your post that could have saved many relationships shared here, either as married couples or friendly exes. Your honesty, compassion, non judgemental communication, and a surprising willingness to try new things in the bedroom clearly saved your relationship. I also admire the fact that you knew he identified as gay, knew about the cheating, knew he had shared this with his highschool friends, and yet allowed him to work through these issues with professional help. That took a lot of courage. There is nothing worse than struggling with depression while the relationship equivalent of a sword of Damocles is hanging over your head. (I know from experience.) All relationships should be based on similar levels of love, trust, and a willingness on the part of both spouses to work through various issues as you've so admirably done. Bravo!
There are however a number of red flags with what you shared. I am no expert so I'm just sharing my own experience and opinions. So please forgive me if anything I write is judgemental or offensive because that's not my intention. You wrote that your husband was raised southern Baptist, was sexually abused while a teenager, and had little attraction to girls in high school. Later you shared that he traveled a lot for work. And you also shared, "It only happened one time and then he felt so guilty that he could not do it again." In another part of your post you wrote: "He has no attraction to females, other than me." Let me explain why these are red flags based on my own experience.
My ex-wife is convinced that I am gay because of an absent father coupled with sexual abuse. This is a common belief among people who believe that being gay is behavioural ('a choice') or environmental ('initiated into the lifestyle') rather than genetic. I made the mistake of once sharing with her that a Catholic priest took a little too much of an interest in my altar boy frock. She is now convinced that I am gay because of some heavy petting by a frocked creep. Another common justification for gay sons is an absent father and/or dominant mother. I personally believe that I was born gay rather than 'initiated' through some man in my life or absence thereof. Why is this important? Because young gay people need to understand that being gay is like having blue eyes or being left handed. It's involuntary. When we assume it's voluntary or a choice, we then go down the wrong path of assuming we can be 'cured' by simply trying harder. We need look no further than the numerous posts here to understand that hard work and communication alone can't change sexual orientation.
Another red flag is the "just one time" argument. (Another version of this excuse is the husband caught red-handed on Craig's List saying he was just "curious" but never acted on it.) I've used this excuse for smoking, drugs, drinking, and (later) for gay sex. Again as many straight spouses have shared here, the "one time" argument often hides years if not decades of infidelity. But later you acknowledge and accept that he cheated in a very caring and non-judgemental way.
My final concern is something you shared: "He has no attraction to females, other than me." This would tend to suggest that he's a gay man choosing to remain in a straight marriage. I tried this for a time and it didn't end well. My relationship felt like being married to a female cousin. This is why intimacy was so bizarre. Once I'd kissed a man, it was game over and I knew there could be no going back. Turning to your relationship, my only fear here is that despite his commitment to remain monogamous and your astounding openness to things he finds sexually exciting, he still might want to seek sex outside of your relationship. I think this may be where so many genuinely concerned straight spouses roll their eyes and collectively think, "I was there too sister." There is a common thread among the spouses here that they were the only ones who understood their spouses and could 'save' or 'fix' them. But I'm not too concerned because you've clearly built up enough love, support, and honesty that he'd feel comfortable enough sharing his feelings with you. But I still can't help but feel he may one day announce that he's met the love of his life and plans to leave you. Maybe I'm just projecting my life story on the two of you?
I'm just one gay (and perhaps jaded) divorced man sharing my opinions so please don't take offence to anything I've written. I wrote the above out of love and concern. Regardless of what I've shared, Jerseygirl I do truly admire your courage, honestly, compassion, and commitment! Your husband is a very lucky man. I guess my point is that even if my ex-wife had done all of what you shared, we still wouldn't have remained together because I fell in love with another person (who happened to be a man). Thanks again for so bravely sharing your story here.
Posted by Steve October 10, 2016 1:24 pm | #82 |
WendiT... Thankyou so much.
Yes that was my SSN cohort:
Patti (of course) - The Queen of SSN.
jj - So dry but such a lovely lady
Brad - Funniest man who ever posted here. He's my SSN brother.
JV - Full of spunk
Esther - Lovely, lovely woman
Bruce - My God! His posts. Weird. Fascinating.
David - The only other Aussie I know of that posted here
Damon - Portia's main nemesis
Brandon
Clif - still lurking
Old Rob - We've had a few Rob's
Aaron - He hates that I remember him as 'the Catholic'
The California Beach Girl - Damn I can't remember her name. She used to tease us boys about driving a tractor in a bikini top.
And of course Diff - Our first gay guy. I don't know what happened to him. I hope he's still lurking.
I'm sure I've omitted many. I love and miss them all. I am still Facebook friends with half the people on that list.
If you do it right some people here will become friends for life.
Posted by Steve October 10, 2016 1:42 pm | #83 |
)))JK(((. *hug*. Beautiful post
Posted by WendiT October 10, 2016 1:51 pm | #84 |
Steve, thank you for the confirmation. Yes, JV was there in the earliest days too along with jj and Patti. Your post made me smile remembering the "usuals", all people I have never met but who have made such a difference in my life. Amazing amazing people who let it all hang out and through the pain made lemonade out of lemons. Although we may fight from time to time, for me the good outweighs the bad. Hopefully someday I will be able to convey my thanks in person. But til then, please pass my gratitude on to all. - WT
PS - get some sleep, man.
Posted by JerseyGirl October 10, 2016 2:03 pm | #85 |
Sean, I do understand that his sexual abuse has nothing to do with his sexual orientation. He knows that too, but it is part of his history and one of the reasons why he fought it so hard later. He felt guilty for allowing it to happen and for enjoying the sexual part of it. It is one of the things he is working on in his therapy. I know that he was not "Made" Gay. He did not Choose to be Gay, it is how he was born. The only part that still confuses me is the fact that his therapist is so adamant that he is Gay and not Bi. To me, if he were Gay, he would not be able to perform with me at all, and he can with no problems. He had sexual relationships with women before I met him, but with them he had performance problems. And the one woman who made the comment to him about that, only served to make him even less sure of himself which caused him to have even more anxiety. According to the therapist, he was able to have relationships because he was trying to conform to what was expected from a male in that time period and based on his upbringing. He also had sex with men throughout his 20s and 30s but because of him fighting his orientation and the guilt, he did not do so often. Since he has been with me, he has had only one encounter. He also has never looked at it as anything more than Sexual release. He does not and has not ever wanted to have a relationship with a man. What he wants is the feeling he gets from the sex itself and that is being met now. His therapist has told him that only he knows what he wants, that he cannot tell hubby nor can I. He knows what is in his heart and how he feels. They have been working hard on how his upbringing forced him in one direction when he was being pulled in another based on his orientation. We have talked a lot about that between the two of us also, because I too wondered how I could be enough. About whether he would need a man to feel completely satisfied. He has repeatedly said to both the therapist and me, that is not what he needs, he needs the sex itself, he doesn't need to walk down the street holding a man's hand, he doesn't need to be held by a man to feel happy and complete. To him, it was, and is, just sex. There was never any kissing...he'd meet, have sex, and leave. That was it. Perhaps it is not the same for everyone? Maybe the rest of what we have together (our love, respect, son, home, interests, laughter, fun) are giving him what he needs emotionally so all that was missing for him was the sex? I don't know, but for now he is happy and so much less stressed than he has been for a long time.
I know that the future is not guaranteed, it is not guaranteed for any one of us, str8, Gay, Bi, whatever. If he were to come to me and tell me he needed more, then we would discuss it, and figure out what we needed to do so that he could have that, but he does not feel that will happen. Worrying about something that may or not happen only causes more problems now. We take it one day at a time. I am not trying to change him or make him "not Gay". No one can do that. He is who he is and that is a part of him. He is the same loving and kind man that he always has been and as long as he treats me with respect and is honest with me, we will work things through as they come.
Posted by Daryl October 10, 2016 2:43 pm | #86 |
What a difference a weekend makes! I am in Canada and this is Thanksgiving weekend. Thanks to all for being here, revealing so many personal thoughts and feelings, and respecting each others opinions, even when they differ.
Posted by Sam (Admin) October 10, 2016 2:52 pm | #87 |
Steve wrote:
Several times in the past this forum has been described as being like the Wild West. When you walk into this saloon ANYONE could be here. I'm sorry to say it's not (necessarily) a 'safe' place. Membership is NOT controlled although in EXTREME cases you can get blocked. In all the years I've been here (on and off) I only know of one time someone got blocked although it has probably happened more. Only Sam (Admin) knows.
I've tried to monitor as "lightly" as I can, rarely ever delete or edit anything but direct personal attacks and spam. Yes, the only regular I ever banned (other than spammers and trolls) was Portia, and that was at HER request. She would spar with some, and sometimes would get a little personal in her attacks. Otherwise she had some good insights. She told me she "couldn't help herself" sometimes and so requested she be banned. Because of the way the old forum worked, I couldn't block just her and wound up having to block an entire government agency. I hoped at the time that no one else at that agency needed the forum.
We are currently looking into updating the main SSN website to make it more emphasizing of the multiple paths people can take in this situation. I'm considering a MOM section here, while trying to keep this forum as uncomplicated as possible. The biggest complaint I've had so far is the increased complexity over the old simple (and very much outdated) forum.
Posted by Séan October 10, 2016 3:41 pm | #88 |
Jerseygirl I salute you. All roads are different...and many are bumpy as hell! No matter what path we take, I wish you both much love & happiness. As you wrote, there are no guarantees in this crazy thing called life. I hope to be as loving, kind, and compassionate as you've been with your spouse. You're an example and I've learned from our brief exchange. Thank you.
Posted by Steve October 10, 2016 4:39 pm | #89 |
Sam (Admin) wrote:
We are currently looking into updating the main SSN website to make it more emphasizing of the multiple paths people can take in this situation. I'm considering a MOM section here, while trying to keep this forum as uncomplicated as possible. The biggest complaint I've had so far is the increased complexity over the old simple (and very much outdated) forum.
Love your work Sam. Thanks.
Posted by vicky October 11, 2016 8:35 am | #90 |
Steve.
You called me out as if I was giving you a hard time about suggesting others leave. I didn't take offense to your earlier posts. There were other posts where that suggestion was made I don't tattle tale so you can figure it out.
Vicky