Sean wrote:

I have a few questions if you don't mind:

1. If I'm reading your post correctly, did you both agree to have an open marriage? Yes
2. Has your husband confessed to cheating with other men? No
...does he still maintain the contact was "virtual" or via internet, chat, or text? Yes
​3. If he hasn't yet had sex with another man, how then does he know he might be bisexual? He desires/fantasises about men AND women. Does he have to have penetration with a man to be bisexual? (he has sucked cock)

"Thanks in advance for your answers my friend. I hope you, your husband, and family aren't suffering..."
I'm in those troubled waters all by myself...except for you SSNetworkers  

Duped wrote:

Ellexoh, if you had an open marriage, presumably this wasn't so he could just sleep with other women? Why do you think he hasn't slept with men in his open marriage if he desires them and has given them oral sex. I can't understand what would have stopped him having penetrative sex with men.

 

Initially....I had no other reason to think it wasn't 'just' women. We got on well, it was exciting, we were doing it together. 
No I can't adamantly state he hasn't done more than suck cock, but just because there is tension and upheaval in the r'ship now.....doesn't mean he's lied about NOT having ever had sex with a man. 
That may scream "head in the sand" to many of you reading this....but the trust in my partner that I no longer have (and man! that drives a knife into my heart)..means I'll be careful of any accusations/suspicions I positively make...
....to preserve my own sanity & integrity rather than giving him the benefit of the doubt. 

 

Thank you Sean I appreciate your feed back.

I know the truth and I'm getting out there and healing myself... Now time for the hard stuff of leaving him out there on his own.....

Thanks heaps!

Thank you for writing Lena. Before responding to questions about your children, I'd urge you to contact a child psychiatrist, children's counsellor, or any other qualified specialist with specific experience in these kinds of situations. Perhaps the Straight Spouse Network could help you find someone qualified. With that in mind, I'll try to answer your questions:

1. But how should I feel confident about him having shared custody if he is still under denial and having those hook ups? Meaning if he is still tormented about his sexuality since he keeps himself hidden,  would this affect their well being?

I'm happy to share my own experience and similar experiences that my gay friends have shared with me. I came out to my wife back in May 2012. Following my coming out, I went through what's often referred to as "gay adolescence" or a "slut phase." The only way I can describe it is like this: it was like coming out of some sexual Sahara Desert. Having held back my attraction to men my whole life, I felt parched. Then I literally gorged myself. I went from being a responsible 40-something dad and businessman, to a sex-crazed teenager who'd fret when my lover didn't put an exclamation point at the end of his text messages (true story). I think my "gay adolescence" lasted roughly 18 months and during that time, my children were not my priority. Moreover, I firmly believe that like attracts like so during this gay adolescent phase, I wasn't seeing the most mentally stable men. I surrounded myself with a lot of promiscuous, self-centred, and damaged men during my "slut phase" but I was careful not to introduce any of these men to my kids which was the right decision for everyone I reckon. Getting back to your question, yes I do believe that dad remaining in the closet can negatively affect your children. Why? Because he's lying and being inauthentic...both poor examples for children. Moreover, he'll likely hang around and hook up with other closeted (read: broken) men which will just prolonge his own gay adolescence I believe.

2. Should we keep this sexual orientation info away from them at this point and let them to heal first from their parents break up?  Is it possible to keep this away from them if he claims not being ready for the world to know about him or if I am not ready for them to know at this age yet?

I'd consult with a mental health professional on this one. Before our own break up, my (then) wife and I consulted with a child psychologist who recommended the following: first separation; second dad comes out; divorce; then dad can talk about his new relationship. This worked for us. Looking back, I believe that secrets are toxic, mainly for the people keeping them. Most of the people I came out to already knew or at least suspected and I've read similar posts here. What I wanted to avoid with my own children was much bigger than just my sexuality. The bigger lesson was about honesty and authenticity. While their mom and I "pretended" in a broken gay/straight relationship, we forced our children to hide their emotions, keep secrets, and we gave them the worst example of what a marriage should look like. Whether or not your husband comes out (or you out him) is secondary. We should strive to teach our children that they matter, their emotions matter, and that we're here for them. Whether or not this involves your husband coming out isn't as important as how they feel and making them feel safe enough to share this with you. I hope that makes sense.

3. Or if in a meanwhile he falls in love with a man who makes him to want to get out from the closet is it ok for them to be introduced to that type of their father's sexuality when they still cope with their parents divorce (we did not take legal steps yet, gathering info only, preparing yourself for this journey)? Was it going to be too much for them?

​During "gay adolescence" I'd be ready for your husband to talk about "the one" and perhaps even want to introduce a new partner to your kids. If he's anything like me, he'll likely mistake puppy love or sexual attraction for a stable long-term relationship. I'd recommend setting some ground rules before you split, namely that neither of you will introduce any new partners until you've been together for at least 12-18 months. It's unlikely his first few "gay adolescent" relationships will work out so setting rules is probably a good idea.

​3. When did your kids find out about you? Do you think there is better age to explain this matter or it does not matter when?

​I told my kids I was gay roughly six months after separating from their mother. I don't believe there is an age appropriate time to tell kids nor some hard and fast rule. With their mother's consent and after consulting with a child psychologist, I told my kids I was gay. It also coincided with a time when I myself was ready, had come out to my friends and family, and was well on my way to fully accepting my own homosexuality.

​I hope I've answered your questions Lena. If not, please feel free to post again.
 

Last edited by Sean (August 17, 2017 12:41 am)

My pleasure Lena. I hope your divorce is amicable.

I've just read this fascinating post from a new member named Joescookie. Joe provides a gut-wrenching example of discovery, his gay wife's denial, bargaining with reality ("Maybe she isn't gay?"), his wife going on a narcissist-fueled attack with accusations of everything she's likely doing (like cheating), and the honeymoon phase post discovery with his gay-in-denial wife's renewed interest in sex after years of little to no interest in sex with him. She's also suggesting a threesome, with another woman of course, something I've read about in other posts. (I guess it's common that the gay-in-denial spouse wants their straight spouse present during gay sex like some f*cked up emotional anchor to their heterosexuality.) He writes: "She would like to have the third (woman) go down on her and vice versa." Joe comes across as a very kind, caring, and honest man so I'd encourage you all to read his posts and share your own experiences. Here again is the link.

This particular passage Joe wrote resonated with me: "I caught her going to a lunchtime massage with a woman she worked with a few years back; she paid for both of them. She denied that until I showed her the bank statements. [Later]...said she didn't want me to get mad about her spending our money."

​A question I hear often is, "Why do gay in denial (GID) spouses continue to lie, deny and deflect, even when presented with overwhelming proof of their homosexuality?" While I'm not a mental health professional, I'm happy to share my own experience and opinion. Joe mentioned that he's in his 40s so I'll assume he and his wife are the about the same age. I first felt an attraction to boys at age 5 or 6 and started hiding it almost immediately. I married a woman at age 27, had three kids in my 30s, and came out at age 40. So I'd been hiding my sexuality from myself and others for almost 35 years. As such, my denial and lying were hard-wired. This isn't something a straight spouse can undo in just a tearful conversation, nor therapy session, particularly when the gay spouse has his/her back to the wall. Sadly this forum is full of heart-breaking posts detailing the lengths to which straight spouses try to "fix" their gay-in-denial husbands/wives. That got me thinking. ​If like Joe you've found yourself in the following situation:

​1. A (largely) sexless marriage and the infrequent sex you have seems to be completely without passion.
​2. Your spouse's web history is exclusively gay.
​3. Your spouse has a gay best friend, gay co-worker, or another gay acquaintance they constantly talk about, travel with, or spend time with.
​4. There is irrefutable proof of online chatting on gay sites, hookup sites, cam (virtual sex) sites, or Craigslist.
​5. You are posting here.

If you find yourself in the above situation, there is a very strong likelihood that your spouse is indeed gay. If you are posting here for the first time, here is what I recommend straight spouses do:

1. Start by writing a relationship constitution. This can be a short letter to yourself or a long list of the relationship (or life partner) YOU DESERVE. Please note that this has nothing to do with your present relationship, your current partner, nor your suspicion that your spouse might be gay in denial. You are simply writing down the kind of love what you want, need, and deserve. Take your time and think about exactly what you want. Once finished, I'd recommend reading this document daily to remind yourself that this journey is now 100% about you, about love, and about living a happy life.    
​2. Find a therapist FOR YOU. This is not a couples therapist, this is someone who will focus 100% on you and your mental health. If you are posting here, you've probably been sacrificing your needs for years, if not decades. Moreover your feelings have been hurt and your heart broken due to recent events. YOUR FEELINGS AND EMOTIONS ARE IMPORTANT so you should find a caring and competent professional to help you work through all of this.  
3. Reach out to the Straight Spouse Network ("SSN") to find a therapist, counsellor, or psychiatrist in your area who has experience treating people in gay/straight marriages. Therapy sessions can be over the phone or via Skype call. I can't emphasize how important it is to find someone with experience counselling people in gay/straight relationships. Choosing an experienced therapist is very important.  
​4. In addition to finding a mental health professional, contact the SSN to find a fellow straight spouse and call him/her. You can also reach out to a long-term member here. It's important to share YOUR story over the phone with someone who has survived the same ordeal and thrived after divorce.
​5. Start posting here, daily if necessary, and share EVERYTHING. This forum is an invaluable resource for you to heal.  
​6. Now that you've written your relationship constitution, have a therapist, have an SSN contact, and have started posting here regularly, you're now ready to accept that you'll likely never hear, "Yes I'm gay" from your spouse.
​7. Accept that you'll likely never hear the whole truth from a spouse who has lied his/her whole life about their sexuality. This doesn't make your spouse evil, just confused.
​8. With 6 and 7 in mind, write down how your gay-in-denial spouse's lies, cheating, deflections, and verbal abuse make you feel. Then compare this with your relationship constitution.
​9. When you're ready, share your story with a family member or close friend WHO IS 100% ON YOUR SIDE. This means someone who is not at all invested in keeping you in your current relationship. Remember that sharing your relationship problems with a caring ally will lighten the burden on you.
​10. Stop looking to your gay-in-denial spouse for honest answers. Honesty is simply a language they don't understand. (I know from experience.) The facts speak for themselves. If necessary, write down the facts and remove all names (and all subjectivity) from your story. Accept that if your spouse is surfing and masturbating to gay or lesbian porn, hooking up with the same sex, and lying about it all, THIS IS NOT LOVE...NOR A HEALTHY RELATIONSHIP FOR YOU.

​In brief, it's time to focus on you, your feelings, and creating a support network to help YOU on your journey...with or without your gay spouse. You should focus on and take care of the only person you can truly change: YOU. In my opinion, the wrong approach would be to focus exclusively on your gay-in-denial spouse. All too often, the straight spouse acts like a co-dependent or enabler which to me means: trying to "cure" or "fix" someone who was born gay; dragging a gay spouse to couples therapy without having fully worked through your own feelings or (worse still) hearing that all talk of sexuality is "off limits"; wasting years or even decades playing detective only to have the gay spouse continue to cheat and bald-face lie about it. While we have all been distracted by the gay thing, this journey is ultimately about you and your happiness. Love is about being with someone who makes you feel desired, sexy, respected, and appreciated. Most straight spouses move on when they finally accept their partners were born attracted to the same sex, this can't be changed, and that their gay/straight relationship simply doesn't work. It can take days, months, or years to reach this point. Take all the time you need my friends, but don't fall for the trap of focusing 100% on your broken partner. He or she has to heal WITHOUT YOU.     

I hope that helps my friends. Please feel free to send me any questions you might have for a gay ex-husband.

Last edited by Sean (August 25, 2017 5:54 am)