Sean, I like some of your honest comments and I like a challenge. However, I also need to call you out on some of your BS.

I don't want to run the risk of his wife texting me at 3 a.m.
BS, dude. Why would a woman ever text a random guy if she knows exactly what's happening? Husbands on the down-low (i.e. those that aren't transparent with their wives) are the biggest risk of creating drama like this, and unfortunately, this drama is actually very attractive to some men.

Men, regardless of their sexual orientations, are exceedingly good at having detached and emotionless sex.
I agree (and my original post about modern dating reflects it). And because we live in a world that is still, sadly, run by men, this standard of "detached and emotionless sex" has been pushed onto women, too. I refuse to accept it. So do many men - particularly those who have experienced long-term committed relationships (read some of the husbands' threads on this forum for a starter).

Gay men are sublimely capable of having guilt-free sex with other men in places like saunas and cruising parks. (Lesbians don't have similar spaces.) While this may be seen as a moral failing or existential threat among heterosexual women (and by proxy their husbands/partners), open relationships and anonymous sex are normal and healthy among the majority of gay couples. We've long accepted that gay men are terrible at monogamy so we've successfully incorporated this reality into our long-term relationships. And most of those relationships work because we adopt a "don't ask don't tell" stance because we've learned over the past 60 years that less is better in these situations.

This is a very honest point you are making. Thank you. Hurray for sex positivity (I guess). However, that's where I call your other BS.

For years on this forum, you have made an industry out of preaching that the "gay lifestyle" is a homophobic myth. What you describe above is exactly what people mean by "gay lifestyle". I think it's partially due to the trauma of growing up LGBTQ, acting out, having second adolescence, etc. Though, as you say, gay women don't have the same culture, so I think it is primarily due to too much superficial masculine sexual energy in one place without any feminine energy to ground it (too much yan and no yin if you're into Asian philosophies). Many men (regardless of their attractions) simply don't want to live like that. It's their deal how they reconcile their attractions with lifestyle preferences and other identities (stay married to women, go celibate, find gay unicorn husbands, etc.), but many don't want what you describe. That is neither sex negative, nor homophobic, my friend. Nobody stops YOU from doing it. Nobody is arguing your rights. But you shouldn't impose your lifestyle on others either.

Similarly, I believe that some bisexual men choose a "gay lifestyle" because of the accessibility of sex. As well as some straight(ish) men choose to cheat on their wives with men because it's a lot easier to find a man for a fleeting sexual encounter.

While I don't assign morality to any sexual behaviour, I don't believe anonymous sex is generally healthy. It possibly can be, but more often than not it creates a fertile ground for compulsive behaviours - and those are damaging regardless of gender or orientation. Coming back to my original post - modern dating and the use of apps (gay or straight) promotes compulsive behaviours and feeds dopamine and sex addictions.

There is a big difference between sex positivity and sex addiction.

Personally, I am sad that sex is becoming commoditised (and has long been such in the gay world as you note in your message). It doesn't have to be like that. Did you read Velvet Rage? There are a few really good points made in the last part of that book.

So what's my point? While your husband's openness and transparency are seen as strengths in the heterosexual world, gay men and gay couples better understand the long-term risk.
That's where you stop making sense, my friend, and I don't think you would find much support for what you said in the gay community. You are basically saying that openness and transparency is valued by straight, but not by gay. This puts a very different lens on your story of a "recovering narcissist now living a transparent life". It really sounds more like a story of a "narcissist still not living a transparent life, but he put himself in an environment where nobody cares and does the same". I tend to believe that while many people (gay or straight) find openness and authenticity challenging, it's good for everyone. I don't want to open a dispute on this - I will just leave my thoughts here with you. Again, Velvet Rage part four paints a very good picture. So do most spiritual texts. So do books on polyamory. Frankly, you would struggle to find any source that would consider "don't ask, don't tell" the best approach to life, emotions or relationships.

Perhaps it's time to stop square pegging a round hole. If your husband wants to be sexually active in the gay community, he'll probably have to adapt to our community's norms...
Interesting choice of a metaphor, and thank you for confirming you need an approval to be gay! Since your advice is really more for my husband - I have passed it along. I will post his reply if he has a chance and the inspiration to respond. His initial reaction was a burst of laughter and a "See, I've always said you need a membership card!"

Sean, we've been following each other for a while. My agenda in running this thread is pretty clear - I try to help people to decipher real relationship red flags from imaginary ones. I do it through a painfully honest recount of my personal life. It's a 3 year project and I'm about half-way in. It's not about "waving a MOM banner" - MOM is absolutely, 100% not for everyone! It's about showing what it is and letting people make their own decisions. What is your agenda? On the surface it sure looks like it is to convince as many people as you can that they are gay..lol.. Really? Is it worth your time? You can reply in your thread - maybe dig deeper than the "recovering narcissist" story this time 😉

Oh, and most importantly, congratulations on your wedding!!! 🎉🥳👬🌈

Hi Sean

You did not offend either of us in any way! I just needed to call out some inconsistencies. Maybe let's move your reply (about Sean) to your thread - ex gay-husband answering questions for those following.

I don't necessarily see either option as threatening.

Obviously, the third one is the best for the relationship, but I don't want to take shortcuts to get there.The only reason I support his exploration is because I genuinely want him to find himself and be happy (with me or without me). He already deems he can be totally fulfilled by me. After all, we lived monogamously our entire marriage. The man is totally capable of monogamy.

The first one seems healthier - at least physically/medically. I'd be wary having sex with him if he lived "the lifestyle."

I think there's a bunch of other possible options on the table, for example:
1) once he explores further and overcomes his fundamental mistrust of men, his desire to be with a particular man (or men in geberal) overtakes his desire to be with me - then our relationship will naturally disolve
2) he explores further and realises that he has been craving social connection with men rather than sexual - due to his childhood trauma he doesn't have many male friends - so he switches his focus to building friendships. Kind of like your option 3, but nuanced
3) we find someone we both like and date together

Totally agree he is looking for a unicorn! Not quite chateaubriand, but let’s say an exquisite vegan meal. But wouldn't you if you were well catered at home? I mean, many people still crave McDonald's... but yeah, we aren't exactly McDonald's eaters. Imagine you haven't been out in 15 years (longer in his case), you decide to try out the restaurants, go out and all you have is McDonald's. It's masked as all sorts of different places but they all serve the same junk food. Would you eat? Or would you be frustrated? He seems to be frustrated and going back home for dinner.

Thank you friend, I'll pass your thoughts along. He's been looking for something like that.