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From time to time, we've touched on the issue of telling your kids what's going on in the marriage -- or, in the case of divorce, the reason underlying your split. I thought this deserved its own thread, because so many people ask about it: how much to tell, whether to explain the reasons for your split, etc.
Often therapists advise against it, on the argument that it's unhealthy for kids to be drawn into their parents' divorce. I think the problem is that they're taking a general rule of thumb, and turning it into an ironclad law. I don't think they fully understand how much this issue "belongs" to the kids, in addition to being of concern to the spouses. It's devastating enough to learn this about your family of origin, but learning that you've been lied to by both parents is exponentially worse. I strongly suspect if you asked the kids what they think, they would be unanimous: this is my origin story, and I'm entitled to know it. I know that's how my daughter responded.
I decided my daughter absolutely had to be told the truth, although I delayed a short time because I didn't want to disrupt her senior year in college.
My biggest concern grew from an incident I'd never forgotten, that had hit the tabloids years earlier, when a highly respected partner at a prestigious Wall Street law firm, was murdered by a male prostitute in a Bronx motel where you could rent rooms by the hour. The coverage was voyeuristic and lurid; the man's wife and adult children had no clue he was gay at all (nor did anyone at the law firm know). It sounded like the funeral itself became a media circus.
This brief article is one of the more palatable ones; most of the coverage was considerably more sensationalist:
Personally, I was horrified at the torment this wife must have suffered in this moment, and when I discovered my husband's secret, I knew absolutely that I was not going to run the risk that my daughter would have to find out this way. No matter what the professional therapists might advise, I was not going to risk this.
There were also other factors I was concerned with. There was a very real possibility that she had already guessed the truth, and was covering for her father to spare me pain. That turned out not to be the case, but it was a real possibility; she'd once found porn on his computer, and there were other clues left around that she'd been hiding from me. While she hadn't guessed the gay part of the equation, she had been struggling to keep the burden of other secrets she herself didn't understand.
So I do think in my case, the "experts" are wrong, but I'm really curious to know your experiences. Did you talk to your kids? If you had to do it over, would you do it the same way? Have your kids ever expressed a wish that they hadn't been told? I know for my own daughter, she insists she is better off knowing, even if it's painful. I think that if I'd hidden the truth from her, and she'd found out, she never would have forgiven me for lying to her.
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We told our children about a week ago that we were separating. I chose not to divulge the reason for our split for two reasons. One is that what is happening between my husband and myself is between us. The other is that as my husband has not accepted the fact that he is gay, I didn't want to set off an emotional breakdown for him. It's not my call as to when he should come out. I have recommended therapy for him and he is considering it. If the time comes that he is finally ready to come out, I will be there with him when he tells our children.
My kids are slightly younger than yours...15, 17, and 19. They mostly want to know how our separation will affect them. That is what we talked about with them. I have worked very hard to put my anger aside so that we can effectively co-parent our children. It is all so very new for us and things might change but we are working hard to make sure there are no "bad" guys in this and so that our children know they do not have to choose between us. We have even gone so far as to say if they want to do something with both of us it can be done. All of this has helped my kids to deal with it pretty well so far. I know we're going to face challenges but so far it's going as well as can be expected. That's my long winded way of saying I don't think the "experts" can make a hard fast rule about something like this.
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I think, as is evident from the previous posts, that it very much depends on the age of the kids.
My kids were adults and really went through a lot of what we have all gone through.
One of the people they trusted most in the world has lied to them. They wonder when the lies started. Was he gay when they turned 21? Started school? Did he wish he'd never married? Did he regret their existence? How will they organise holidays to be as kind as they can to me, whilst still considering their father? What about the significant other? etc.What about future family milestones?
Any child, no matter how old, will have questions about the new normal.
But, as has been mentioned earlier and elsewhere, at some stage they need to know that marriage is to be revered and is only over because there is no alternative. And i know my kids feel as if i have been honest with them and did not decide what they needed to know (if it was appropriate of course!). But....they are adults.
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Walkbymyself, I am so thrilled you started this thread, because I am really struggling with this. I started to respond but realized I still have so many conflicted feelings, I will need to think more about it before really adding my full two cents.
For now, son knows some information, but not all. He had just turned 14 when I kicked STBX out, and is 15.5 now. I can better explain all the factors another time, but I started down this path a bit by accident, because I wasn't sure how things were going to unfold. STBX admitted he was bringing anonymous male sex partners to our home going back six years. My immediate concerns were to get him out of the house and change the locks. I had a dear gay friend from college who was murdered in 1998 by an anonymous sex partner that he met on vacation. Every news report, like the one listed above by Walkbymyself and the one just this week about the Toronto serial killer's confession, puts me right back in a feeling of fear and pain and panic. I could never have gone on living in the same house with my STBX after he told me that. My STBX also knew my friend who was killed--he said he wasn't too surprised that I reacted the way I did--he knows full well that what he does is dangerous on many levels (disease, etc.) and it may be that the danger and self-destructive aspect makes it all the more attractive to him. (And he may possibly take sadistic pleasure in causing me pain? Not clear, but he knew full well this history and event and how it affected me and our friends.) STBX is in total denial and has been really erratic and sometimes abusive since the separation. I told son I no longer trusted dad and dad had friends around the house that I didn't know and didn't trust, and therefore we were going to be safe and set this new boundary.
So--the fear of what's next is real--and all the variations of what might happen next are many, and the only positive one--that my husband gets healthy and comes out--seems remote. I can explain more another time but for now, we are still in the middle limbo, and I am mainly focused on getting out of the marriage safely and keeping things as routine and stable as possible for my son. Our therapists support and recommend that middle ground, but also advised to work toward full disclosure as the situation changes/warrants, and as my son becomes an adult (closer to 18).
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This is a very real struggle for me as well. STBXGH and I will tell our sons (23 and 18) next weekend about our current separation and ultimate divorce. We plan to not tell them of TGT, but hubby assures me that we will soon (in 2-3 months) as he's still struggling himself as to how to tell people (which will be a very select and quite small group..mostly just family.) He has agreed to tell the truth if our sons ask pointed questions. The 2 of us have sat down and we've written a "script" to read to the kids, as I don't trust myself to not completely break down during "the talk." I'm just gutted that I have to tell them what going on and that their family life will never be the same. They're good kids, pretty emotionally stable, and they'll eventually get used to the change, but it still makes me so sad.
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I should say, I really struggled with questions of whether there might be a way to tell my daughter "half" the truth, or "three-quarters" of the truth, because at a certain point it seemed impossible to find a place to draw the line and say "we can stop here and not tell her more than this." In our situation, that was really difficult because there were things that directly involved my daughter -- before I made the discovery, for example, she had come home from college and found a condom wrapper in her bed. I blamed some contractors who had been doing the floors, but it always bothered me that I didn't think it was really plausible that they'd have had the opportunity to carry this off in our house, which had so many people in it at the time. The contractors in turn blamed my daughter, and my husband just stood by and allowed her to be wrongfully accused.
That's one of the incidents that I'm talking about when I say this involved her. I initially felt like this was between me and my husband, but I've come more around to my daughter's way of thinking, that it's her origin story, too. I was gaslighted for over half my life, but at least the first half of my life was grounded in reality. For her, the gaslighting affected the entirety of her life, from birth. As she sees it, it's far more directly impacting her than me.
Last edited by walkbymyself (February 1, 2019 5:33 pm)
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Sorry for the serial posting -- I'm actually wondering how our kids themselves would respond to this question. I wish we had a "sister organization" for kids to discuss their own perceptions (I know there are meetings and organizations sponsored by Alcoholics Anonymous for adult children of alcoholics).
I think if you were to ask my daughter whether she was better off knowing or not knowing, her very strong response would be that she was better off knowing. Before I'd actually told her, she'd confided in me that she was thinking of seeing a therapist, to help her work through some of the issues she was going to be facing after graduation, starting her job search, etc. She had no clue the bombshell I was about to try, gently and compassionately, to drop on her. But I think that it was fortuitous timing, and it gave her and her therapist a far more comprehensive understanding of the family dynamic.
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walkby,
on the main straight spouse page there's a link for children, and if you click it, you'll see that one such child has created a website for other children. One section of it is Q and A, where the children post their responses to a series of questions. There is no question about "knowing or not knowing," but the replies to the existing questions are enlightening, and perhaps the site's creator would be open to posing that question about whether it's better to know the truth.
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I went to that site for teens/young adults. I really admire the young woman who put it together! I have two young adult children (21 and 24), and two teen boys (16 and 14). After looking at the content on the site, it actually increased my anxiety for my teen boys’ emotional health as I try to figure out my next steps.
I have read and internalized comments on this site lately—not in this thread—about how our own sadness and lack of joy and emotional outbursts and possible withdrawal due to our own trauma—when our kids do not understand these, they think this is who we are and it affects their foundational relationship with us and possibly their own sense of joy in life as their formative years are in a place of underlying sadness.
For years, even before I discovered TGT, my husband had withdrawn more and more from the family, especially from these two younger boys, and he had been very critical of them and me while I tried my best to still have a cheerful and supportive home, though it has been stressful. And I know these boys have absorbed this stress. But because I did not understand what was really going on, I felt it was better for me to try harder and harder to maintain a stable family as much as possible, for them to stay in their home and schools, etc. than to disrupt. I still felt it was my fault that I needed to be happier, that the feeling of sadness I had, the feeling of rejection, that these were my fault and I just needed to be a more positive person! More pretty, more everything. So I tried ever harder to do better hoping my husband would love more and be happier.
Now that things are out, my husband is desperate to hold onto the family and is trying very hard. Meanwhile, I have become sad and withdrawn lately, while my husband—who I now understand has lived his entire life learning to manage inner discord and to pretend, and to put on the shine and charm especially when the chips are down—he is now the happy one with the kids. And doing more with them, etc. The explanation is now, Mom is sick, or mom is disorganized, or mom is depressed.
So I am absorbing all the consequences of my husband’s lack of integrity, even in my relationships with my children. All these thoughts motivate me to be fully honest with my children.
However, the comments on that site for teen/young adult children make me fear how telling my teens will put them into a whirlwind right at a very important stage in their development. If they were younger, I feel, there would be time for them to adapt at home, and the consequences of a tailspin would not be so bad. But how does telling this affect the son who is just right smack in the middle of college choices, entrance exams, applications, etc? Will he be able to focus as he needs to and enjoy his last year of high school, and just when he has started showing signs of resiliency after some rough-but-normal teen disappointments? What about the younger teen who seems to finally have a strong and accepting and positive peer group and good adult connections in our community, and these seem to be helping him though his typical life anxiety?
It is not at all lost on me that my two teen sons’ anxiety may actually be the direct result of growing up surrounded by the underlying unhappiness of living in a closeted home.
I would do anything I could for my children, but I cannot shield them from the real consequences of their dad’s choices. And these choices have been throughout our entire marriage—he knew before we married, at least somewhat. So I did not understand before how I was living my entire marriage in a pretend and destructive place. And my children were too. Possibly my not understanding this actually helped me be my normal cheery self until things kept escalating and getting worse in recent years until my entire life was focused in managing the stress of the unhappy dad and husband. Now that I understand that TGT was always in the background, I feel responsible for at least how my choices affect my children going forward. So I feel urgency, yet do not know what is best for them. And, try as I have these past few months since disclosure—no matter how hard I try for them, I cannot hold it together. I had already loved the best I could in the stress, and when I discovered TGT, everything came crashing down for me. I just do not currently even have the emotional or physical or mental resilience to have clarity, or energy to act, not even with that mother bear sensibility.
Last edited by OnMyOwnTwoFeet (February 6, 2019 1:32 pm)
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On My Own Two Feet,
I understand your dilemma of not wanting to derail your children. I felt the same when my ex disclosed to me back in March of 2015 that he had decided he was transgendered and was planning to transition (he later decided to stay in the closet and have his man cake out in the world and eat it at home while wearing women's lingerie). Our son, who had had a rocky 10 years starting at 15, was just beginning to move ahead in a more stable way, and I was afraid of derailing him. At the time, I kept asking my then husband, "What about XXX [our son]?" and he would simply ignore the question as an inconvenience to his plan.
As I related earlier, I still haven't told our son, who is now living a fully adult life and making good choices. He does know, that we divorced because of something to do with his father, and I suspect he believes his father had an affair (he did actually have what I consider an emotional affair with a former student with whom his relationship had long crossed the line, and was "exploring" whether he might be trans with her, while keeping it all a secret from me). I have actually been surprised at how my son's and my relationship has changed now that I am no longer married to his father, and at what he has revealed he thought about our relationship. He's become protective of me, for one thing, which is quite a shift in the parent-child dynamic! For another, although I was always considered to be "anti-social," I've made an effort to have a full social life since I've been on my own, and my son, seeing my calendar one day, said, "For what it's worth, Mom, I never considered you the anti-social one."
I tell you this, OnMyOwn, because you might be pleasantly surprised by how your sons handle the news. And it might be the best thing for your relationship with them to tell them the truth, and for them to see that you were not simply a "sad person" but were struggling along bearing the burden of your husband's decisions and his closeted life. Honesty and transparency are important values to impart to your sons. You are exactly right that you cannot shield them from the consequences of their father's choices, and you shouldn't shield their father from the consequences of his choices, either. It is not our job to suffer their consequences.