I grappled with this for a long time as ex was still in denial, even to me. I decided to tell my family and closest friends for support. I told my adult children too, for support and transparency.

Later I decided to tell my truth to others in my wider circle, also adding that if they know of anyone going thru similar, I'd be glad to meet & support them if needed.

I did NOT tell his family, or put anything on social media that could embarrass him. Yes it's my truth but he didn't want his family to know. As a result, I'm estranged from them, don't see them, and who knows what he says about me?

It's the best I could come up with.

So many questions Byron!  To keep this post from being too long, I'll try to keep the answers brief and to the point.

BryonM wrote:

I'd be interested in hearing your views (or any other formerly heterosexually married gay person's views) on what I am going to call "appropriate outing" as it relates to us and our spouses. I understand respecting my ex-wife's privacy, but I don't see why I should be expected to compromise my integrity to keep a secret for her (not that I've had to do it, she never asked me; just using myself as an example). This gets to be such a sticky wicket if the straight spouse and the gay spouse are not aligned in how to proceed going forward.

Every closeted person feels it is their right to keep their sexuality a secret.  By definition, being closeted means not coming out, and as such, "appropriate outing" doesn't exist - at least from their point of view.

That said, unless a straight spouse wants their gay-ex to stay in the closet, there will inevitably be times when the straight spouse must make a personal and/or moral decision about outing their ex.  My opinion is that straight spouses have every right to say as much as they like, especially because they were victimized by a fundamental secret.  However, it's good to keep in mind that some people don't want to hear the truth and will punish the messenger.  I therefore believe it is in the straight spouse's best interest to be thoughtful about any information they share. 

For anyone who is unsure about what to say, I'd advocate for a conservative approach where you provide minimal information, and only when necessary.  You can always share more in the future but you can't take back something you wish you'd never said.

BryonM wrote:

How did you and your ex manage this when you came out, whom to tell, or not to tell, and how and when to tell, etc. Did you ask her to keep it a secret for you? What was her attitude towards gay people before vs after, if you know?

My ex was publicly humiliated in college when a guy she'd been dating cheated on her with men and everyone knew but her. The very last thing she wanted was to be humiliated again and so she preferred that I stay in the closet.  I mostly have, especially when it comes to people she's known for years.

BryonM wrote:

how did you decide to whom, and when, and how you came out? Did you tell your ex first, or did you test it first on a counselor or therapist, or did you first tell a trusted friend or relative? The reason I ask this is I know I was not the first person my ex came out to, and I know that has to do with fear vs trust and the nature of the relationship. I'm curious to hear other versions from anyone who has done it and how it went, what would they have done differently, or what did they expect the reaction was going to be and how close did it turn in reality?

I've never felt that my sexuality defines me so it's not in my nature to quickly out myself to others.  If people ask or make assumptions, I don't hide or deny. I'm not out to my family, but that's because I'm not close to them.  I am out to my kids.  I told them about six months after my wife and I separated.  As Millennials, they took it in stride.

Generally speaking, I think many closeted married people come out to therapists or close gay friends first.  Spouses aren't usually first (a trial run or two with others often feels necessary in order to gain confidence), but they are usually near the top of the list.

If you'd like to hear some diverse coming out stories, YouTube has hundreds of them - mostly from young unmarried people, but not exclusively.

Hi June - If you register on this site we can privately communicate. 

Just from the little you've said it sounds like you were betrayed in such an incredibly painful way that you're still reeling from the hurt of it.  Being betrayed that brutally doesn't make you a narcissistic sociopath - it's actually quite understandable that you'd need to work hard to make sense of what happened.  I'd love to help, if at all possible.

Cameron,

Thanks for answering my questions. Yes, I had a lot, but they all stemmed from not having had the experience of "coming out," I have only a vague understanding of what it takes to do it. I can't think of anything analogous for a straight person, except for how we say we go into the closet when our spouses leave it - our reluctance to discuss openly what happened, for whatever reason that reluctance is. But I've learned that not discussing it just makes it worse because it starts to eat away at us from the inside. That, I think is what the analogy is between us and our spouses, the eating away at us from the inside.

Two more questions, if I may:

a) What triggered you to come out? Was it voluntary or involuntary - did you decide to do it, did someone else prompt you to do it, or were you caught doing something?

b) We usually start out asking "Are you gay?" because we strongly suspect it already, but we get the instant denial, which tells me that asking it doesn't work. That instant denial sends us into crazy mode, questioning ourselves, and yet we still live with that suspicion, and so we go round and round in circles in our heads. Asking the question often sets us up for failure to get to the truth, because it offers an instant out for him/her, all they have to do is say 'No," and the roadblock is in place. I think it's because the question too often sounds like an accusation. I once said it sounds so "medieval" to try to force a confession.

Once we have enough suspicions (I hate to even use the word "suspicions;" the word alone makes it sound bad), but we have enough reasons to ask the question, is there a more effective way we can encourage our spouse to come out?

Notice that I am trying to approach it from being sensitive to his/her fears - now that I understand better what it is - and trying my damndest not to come at it from being angry or suspicious or accusatory. That is very hard because the hurt naturally leads to anger. And to be 100% honest, some of that anger was at myself, because on some level, I already knew, and had known, but chose not to believe it. Anyway, I think I would have and could have handled it better if I had understood what was going on in my own marriage, and been more honest with myself, too. That's all water under the bridge now, but there's still something to learn from it.

And this instant labeling of narcissism, too, which I think is a mis-diagnosis, or a misunderstanding of what narcissism is. I don't mean to discount anyone else's experience, it's the label and the word that I question. Cameron, you don't come across as narcissistic in your writing, you sound practical, reasonable and based in common-sense. Would you call yourself a narcissist, or any of your gay friends who were married and came out later?  Or how would you categorize it?

I get a picture in my mind of a frightened dog hiding under the porch, and how do I get him to come out from under there; I wouldn't throw rocks or sticks or shout at him, and I wouldn't keep poking at him with a sharp stick. That's only going to get him to show his fangs and come after me, and bite me in self-defense. Instead, I would set out a little dish of water and food and then back off and wait to see what he does. Is there a way for us to do that for our spouses?

Last edited by BryonM (September 13, 2016 2:41 am)