Thanks for your replies Detour. What a terrible experience for all of you. You wrote: 

1. H[usband] was not the only one, the abuser targeted H's younger brother as well.  I knew without a doubt this was not anything fabricated to mask gay in denial...and yet, gay acting out was the main symptom to what was broken."

​Question: is his younger brother gay or otherwise attracted to men? 

2. It's a crazy thing though, my H has a need to feel like everything around him is in control at all times.  The kids could never get too rowdy, the dog is hushed so it doesn't bark but a few barks....I know this has to do with his past but in life you can't control other people as such, the only power one has is over self.  With that said, H only will interact if it is on his terms.  Son would love to play ball in the yard but the best H can do is share a movie.   As you know, kids deserve the world to be centered around them.

​This is how I was shortly before separation. The more I was losing my mind, the harder I'd try to control my wife and kids. I was constantly angry, bullying, and so on. I've described it as the emotional equivalent of standing in the hot August sun in the scratchiest polyster suit. I regret what I put my (then) wife and kids through. Now that I'm out, I the anger, shame, and self-hatred are slowly melting away. I hope you, your husband, and the kids find your own serenity. 

​Thanks again for sharing Detour. Be well! 
 

Last edited by Sean (March 28, 2018 11:35 am)

Thanks for sharing Detour. I'm learning a lot from our exchanges and appreciate you taking the time to post, answer my questions, and share so honestly about your relationship. As I've written before, I was never abused so I'm not an authority on child abuse and how it affects one's sexuality. 

​I am still weary of men who claim that they are gay because of X, with X being child abuse, a domineering mother, an absent father, and so on. I've had some lengthy exchanges with straight wives who still believe that I chose to be gay. And here is my point: if people want to believe that homosexuality is the result of environment rather than genetics, have at it. I couldn't have been raised in a more straight family, community, and world but I still ended up liking antiques, diva female singers, musical theatre, and men. 

​When a husband says he's attracted to men, "Because I was abused as a child," I imagine this gives his straight wife hope. I reckon she hopes and prays that once her husband deals with the emotional damage of the abuse, he'll then "reset" or "reboot" and become the loving husband she needs. Please let me know if you agree Detour. In these circumstances, the straight spouse sees being gay as a form of cancer, therapy or counselling is like chemo or radiation treatment, and hopes her husband's gay impulses will go into some form of remission or he'll be cured. As a gay man, I know that I was born gay and 99% of my gay friends agree with me. We belong to the "nature" group who believe that being gay is genetic. Not surprisingly, the only gay men I know in the "nurture" camp, meaning those who believe being gay is environmental, are those who are still ashamed of being gay.   

​Of course a straight spouse wants to believe child abuse made her husband gay. Given my experience and from what I've read here, she's been providing emotional support for her husband and putting up with a sexless, one-sided, and emotionally abusive relationship since day 1. To accept that her husband was born gay would mean accepting that her entire relationship is a lie, and that her beloved husband is a liar. It's not easy walking away from a lifetime of loving effort put into a relationship. That's why it takes straight wives months, years, or even decades to accept the truth. Time and time again, I've watched straight wives go though the stages of grief before finally accepting, "My husband is gay and there's nothing I can do to change it." Correct me if I'm wrong Detour but when a straight spouse hears her husband say, "I was abused", I expect she feels both sadness mixed with a sense of relief. Relief that it's not her. Relief that she didn't make her husband gay. Relief that there is just one more thing to fix before she feels loved, cherished, and desired.  

​Whether his child abuse claims are true or total fabrications doesn't matter. This is where my viewpoint has changed from just a few weeks ago thanks to Detour. What truly matters is how long straight spouses should wait to have the relationships they deserve. Sadly, I think the abuse claim puts her needs on the backburner, yet again. He's the focus again. He's explaining away his cheating & gay porn again. And the straight spouse continues to wait. So my question for Detour or another other straight spouses who have dealt with their husband's child abuse issues: did it ultimately make a difference? Was he born gay or did he become gay due to child abuse? 

Last edited by Sean (March 29, 2018 4:36 pm)

Hi Cindys. Sorry you're still struggling my friend. Please find below my responses to your questions but keep in mind that I'm not a mental health expert and can only answer based on my own personal experience. In response to your questions: 

1. Can a GIDH loves his wife? What kind of love is it? Is it more like a paternal love?

I think that depends on how you define love. Few define love as: lying; cheating; and not having sex with your spouse. If I think of my own marriage, I really wanted to love my wife and was even good at pretending when there was an audience. I was more in love with the idea of being straight than I was in love with her. While married, I was so closeted and emotionally f*cked up that I don't think I was capable of having a real emotional connection with anyone, let alone my wife. So to answer your question, I think I felt a sort of affection for my wife but it was 100% conditional upon her going along with the lie that I was straight. 

2. Our sex life was ok until our 50's, after he had his "First" sexual encounter with a man and contracted hepatitis B. So we have had a sexless marriage for the past 10 years,  he led me to believe he couldn't get an erection because of ED, he tried 4 times during the 10 years but failed to get an erection. He now claims it was not because of ED but because he felt "guilty," about the sexual male encounter.

This is similar to my own experience. Once I'd had sex with another man, I could no longer have sex with my wife. My feeling is once the closeted gay man has acted on his God-given sexuality, he can no longer have 'pretend' sex with his wife. Turning now to his, "I had sex once" I think the facts confirm he's been having sex with men for much longer. He just can't admit it. 

3. Has my husband always been gay? He is now 64 years old, and he will never never admit he is gay. He claims he only likes anal penetration which he can stimulate himself thru dildos.

I know that I was born gay and 99% of my gay friends feel the same way. Most of what I've read about sexuality also suggests that we're born gay (nature) rather than somehow become gay (nurture). I have a theory and it goes something like this: lots of gay-in-denial men are sexually gay and yet emotionally straight. This means his sexual habits are gay: he watches only gay porn and he only sleeps with men. He's emotionally straight because he's spent so much of his life playing straight and he feels it's too late to come out of the closet without burning the whole house down. 

4. How could I go thru a 43 year marriage and not discover this until now? I loved this man, I feel like such a fool.

You're not a fool for falling in love. You're not a fool for wanting to believe your husband of 40+ years. You're not a fool for wanting a husband who loves and desires you. And you're not a fool for questioning why the facts are different from his spin. 

I think you've made the right decision to separate. Once he's out of the house, you can focus on the most important thing: you. Be well! 

Hi Sean,

When I was a young adult I didn't really have a clear picture of my own sexuality it just was and it was easy to persuade me to believe things against my own instinct but as I got older the picture has become more precise of my own sexuality and for most of us it is like that I think  -  you can see that you have always been the same but now you know yourself better.

The idea of being more 'sexually fluid' - I think it might be more what a gay person feels is possible from their experience, but it is not an idea that comes naturally for a straight person.  A straight needs a straight.  

Logically speaking, it seems to me that it is likely the same for gay - a gay needs a gay so that the attraction is mutual too.  it might not be a sensible idea at all.  Alfred Kinsey was gay too, I believe.

Thank you for writing Lee. Yes I'm still here! In response to your recent post, I believe this is the most important element: 

1. Although he is a generous friend in other ways, I feel this relationship has taken a deep toll on me over the last year or so.  I am beginning to hate myself.  I feel I will never find happiness, that I will never like myself or think myself pretty or sexy again.  Also, I fear I am no better than he:  I lost my mother tragically a few years ago and now have no family, no place to go for the holidays, etc.  He gives me that, and so I justify our relationship by reminding myself how empty my life would be without him.  (In re-reading that sentence, I see how twisted it is.) Lately, though, I've been feeling more and more that I need to escape this relationship.  J tells me he is interested in living together, and that, if we marry, he envisions himself being more comfortable having sex with me.  

I believe love is ultimately about how we feel around the people in our lives. Although rare, some women choose to stay with gay (or gay-in-denial) husbands in gay/straight mixed orientation marriages because they still feel loved and appreciated. So let's put aside the gay thing for a moment and just look at your relationship. You wrote, "I am beginning to hate myself." I reckon that should be the end of it. No one should sacrifice themselves so early on in the relationship. While a break up may seem too early or perhaps too final, I'd suggest trying a short-term separation of say 30-60 days. This means no contact for at least 1-2 months. Going no contact will be difficult, because let's face it being alone is often more challenging than being in even a bad relationship, but pay close attention to how you feel. If you feel better without him, then you know you're ready to move on. If you do reconcile and get back together, be prepared for a "honeymoon" phase when he'll try to act like the man you want to win you back. But it will only last just long enough until you're back in the relationship. Then he'll stop having sex with you again. I'd read up on narcissism to see if he fits the profile of a narcissist. 

2. Hello, I just recently learned about the SSN by way of internet searches for the answer to:  how can I tell if my significant other is gay?  I hope that Sean is still available to answer questions, though I'm a bit ashamed to even be asking...I am a 39 y.o. single woman.  I have been with my boyfriend, J, for almost a year and half.  J is 32 years old, so there is quite an age difference there.  He is the son of Southern parents who embrace liberal politics but in reality live very traditional, conservative lives.  In my opinion, it seems they embrace a sort of "don't ask, don't tell" philosophy where emotional subjects are off the table.  I feel these people only know how to interact with each other on a small-talk basis--the opposite of my family.  

Understood. Please don't feel ashamed to discuss what's wrong with your boyfriend or relationship.  

3. J is very attentive (even needy at times), generous, and caring.  About two months into our relationship, at my urging, we had sex.  It was amazing. 

This is a red flag. You shouldn't have to pressure a 32-year-old male into having sex. He should be kicking down the door to have sex with you. If he's this reluctant at 32, imagine where you'll be at 42, or 52.  

4. One night, when the sex was initiated by him (God, that seems like a zillion years ago), our condom broke.  He expressed extreme anxiety about pregnancy, and never had sex with me again.  I went on the Pill--something no single, childless but child-loving 39 year old woman wants to do--to appease him, but that did not quell is fears. 

I'd urge you to get tested immediately for STDs. I don't want to alarm you but I've read about similar situations before. His violent reaction may be more about fear of you catching something from him, rather than getting pregnant. 

5. There is zero effort on his part to engage me sexually.  No exploration, petting, or stimulation, although he loves to hold hands, and snuggle.  His kisses lack passion and I sense he is eager to stop kissing me (he denies this).  He hates to be alone in his apartment and will often insist on spending the night with me, even though I've told him that sleeping together (not sex) is an intimate act for me and I prefer to only do it with someone I trust deeply. 

Good for you for setting boundaries. Please keep in mind that I'm not a mental health professional. Whether he's gay or straight, after 18 months together you two don't appear to be compatible. He also seems to enjoy appearing to be in love, something I did very well while on stage so to speak, yet that doesn't translate to the bedroom. 

6. Needless to say, we have had many, many arguments about the lack of sexual intimacy.  His excuses vary, but can be summarized as follows: (1) Fear of pregnancy before he is "ready." (2) "Sex isn't right for me right now." (3) General anxiety.[color=#000000] He also reminds me of how much he does for me, how he is always there for me, etc. [/color]

​If you're on birth control, then pregnancy isn't really a risk. So something else is wrong. I'd urge you to get tested for STDs. No woman should have to fight with her boyfriend to have sex. His behaviour now will only get worse (not better) after marriage. 

7. I don't believe in looking through other people's property so I am not aware if he is looking at gay porn, etc. (i.e., on his phone or laptop).

​F*ck that! If you are seriously considering marriage, you have every right to know that he's: STD-free and not cheating on you...with women or men. 

8. Lately, though, I've been feeling more and more that I need to escape this relationship.  J tells me he is interested in living together, and that, if we marry, he envisions himself being more comfortable having sex with me.  

​Run! I've seen this pattern in gay/straight relationships and it's also common in narcissist/empath relationships. He senses that you're going to leave the relationship so he starts future faking with talk about marriage, kids, and a happy life together. But he's talking about a fantasy when you should focus on where you are right now. Whether this guy is gay or straight, you're not sexually compatible and he doesn't make you happy. Full stop. I'm a gay man and even I was having more sex with my (then) wife than this guy. Living together and marriage aren't going to fix what's fundamentally wrong: you want sex and he doesn't. It's time to move on in my opinion. 

9. Please, please help.  Do you think he could be gay?  I need someone to talk some sense into me.  

​I'm very sorry that you're struggling my friend. Before getting into the gay thing, I have some suggestions: 

​a. Get tested immediately for STDs as his reaction could be deep fear that he gave you something. 
​b. Talk to your friends and family about these problems. Now is not the time to be alone nor isolate. 
​c. Talk to a sex therapist. 
​
​With regards to his sexuality, or homosexuality, here are some common traits of gay-in-denial men dating women: 

​1. Conservative and religious upbringing
​2. Strongly anti-gay views and yet strangely almost an obsession with gays & homosexuality 
​3. Very physically fit, well groomed, and well dressed
​4. Most close friends are women but he may allow himself one extremely close gay friend, almost a boyfriend-like relationship
​5. Very secretive with screens and yet always glued to his phone, tablet, or computer
​6. Little to no interest in sex with women, although very comfortable appearing to be in relationships with women
​7. Outwardly charming and charismatic when "on stage", yet manipulative, highly critical, and often cruel in private
​
​The fact that you're posting here is often a very strong indication that your boyfriend is gay. Most importantly, I wouldn't discount your own intuition. Regardless of whether he's gay or straight, this man isn't a good fit for you and likely never will be. Too many straight women have been trapped in gay/straight relationships because he promised things would improve...but never did. If you're having little to no sex now, this will only get worse as you age. If you're starting to hate yourself now, having a ring on your finger won't change anything. I'd recommend reaching out to friends, family, or a mental health professional to see your relationship for what it is now, rather than letting him lie to you about some fake future. I hope that helps my friend.

​Please feel free to write again if you have more questions. Be well! 
 

Last edited by Sean (April 14, 2018 1:25 am)