Thanks for posting everyone. Lily wrote:

1. Sean you use the term 'informed choice'. Floors me really.  How can you make an informed choice if you don't understand what exactly a bisexual is?​

​Agreed. I guess it depends on how you define bisexuality. Given the experience you shared Lily, namely a husband who identified for a time as bisexual and then later claimed he was 100% straight, I can understand how you and other straight spouses could see "bisexual" as nothing more than "a stop on the way to gayville." I get that now. I can take another stab at definining "informed choice." To me it means two potential partners being completely honest about something before ​they make a committment to each other. For example, if a man and a woman start dating, and she tells him about her lifelong attraction to women, is honest about having dated women in the past, and makes it clear that she wants an open relationship, her partner can then make an informed decision. This means he can either agree to continue the relationship or walk away. That's what I meant by informed consent.

I see your point about my own relationship. By hiding my true sexuality and pretending to be straight, I lied to my (then) girlfriend. Had she known she was dating and about to marry a gay man, with zero attraction to women, clearly she would have walked. It's the deception that's so hurtful for straight spouses. By lying we're forcing you into mixed orientation marriages (MOMs) without your consent. Sadly, after disclosure/outing a lot of formerly gay-in-denial husbands then try to force their straight wives to open up their relationships or start acting like men in the bedroom. I can't imagine how painful this must be for straight spouses. I get your points now (and anger/frustration) so thanks again for sharing.      

2. Can you tell me what you think is happening inside a bisexual?  

​I'm afraid I can't because I'm not bisexual. So I have no idea what bisexuals feel.

3. Can you tell me what is happening inside a closeted gay man when he is having sex with his wife? 

​​This I can answer. By way of background, I am 100% gay, meaning I have zero attraction to women. I first felt an attraction to boys at age 5 or 6, denied it, was relieved to have sexual feelings for a particular girl around age 18, married her at 27, had three kids, and then came out at 40. As a gay-in-denial boyfriend/husband, intimacy with my girlfriend/wife always felt like kissing a female cousin. There was no passion. In my teens and 20s, I guess I was just happy to be having sex because I had a very strong sex drive. In my 30s, I discovered gay porn and quickly became addicted to it. Gay porn became my preferred sexual outlet because it was in line with my true sexuality. Strangely I didn't consider it cheating because the sex was virtual. Sadly, my porn habits effectively killed my hetero sex life because I was no longer interested in sex with my wife. In response to your question, most often I had to shut my eyes and fantasize about men in order to perform with my wife. Sex was always mechanical, completely without passion, and I just wanted it to be over as soon as possible. It must have been hell for my (then) wife. I can remember my first kiss with a man. It was like seeing an IMAX film after a lifetime of black & white TV. Once I'd kissed a man, I knew I couldn't stay married to a woman. This is my fear about people considering gay/straight MOMs. Yes there may be friendship, companionship, and genuine feelings in gay/straight relationships, but to spend a lifetime without passion and without real sexual desire for your partner would be like choosing a lifetime of eating bland food without taste.  

​I hope I've answered your questions. If not, please feel free to post again. Be well!  

Last edited by Sean (December 14, 2017 9:46 pm)

It's always a pleasure exchanging posts with you Lily so thank you for sharing. While you and I may struggle with the term "bisexual" it doesn't seem to phase younger generations as much. Case in point: I was working in the city not too long ago when a 20-something woman told a group of us she was bisexual. She said it in such an offhand she could have used the same tone to announce, "I also like coffee." While I wanted to ask a million questions NO ONE under the age of 30 seemed interested nor that surprised. I was floored. I somewhat proudly announced that I was gay...no doubt in some pathetic attempt to sound young and hip. Again, crickets. Times have certainly changed. Be well my friends.  

Last edited by Sean (December 16, 2017 7:31 am)

Hi,  I'm 29 years old i've been married for a year but i never lived with my husband before marriage. I have had many issues some of them are as follows: - has used excuses like i am tired, stress, anxiety, me being too forward, not the right time to not have sex with me- since beginning of our marriage he has had sex with me once a month and a couple of times before marriage- we went to the doctors and he had blood tests and he has no physical condition that would stop him from having sex- the doctor gave us viagra we tried it and had quick sex but he never wants to take viagra he said he doesn't need it- his best friend for more than 10 years is mean to me, he is married and has one child. Once I saw gay porn on his friends computer by accident when we visited him- he will never let me see his phone and deletes msgs with guy friends ( to make space on his phone)- he is always texting his guy friends- he is very homophobic and says horrible things about gay people-on our wedding two males friends of his came to our wedding they slept in the same room. He left the wedding for an hour and went up to there room to apparently smoke a spliff. When he came back he told me the guy tried to kiss him but he pushed him away.  However, on our wedding night he never came to the hotel room where i was staying  till 5am by then i had fallen asleep and we never had sex- if we ever have sex he always does it in the spooning position- his family are homophobic - he tells me to not let him see his guy mates and to stop him from seeing them ( i refused because i didn't understand why he wanted that)-he is 10 years older than me but has only had sexual intercourse with 2 women- his last gf who he was with for 7 years cheated on him many times and tried to kill him because he would not have sex with her-he never gives me foreplay - when i try to have sex with him he tells me he feels claustrophobic- he is always late home and works so many extra hours but has no money to show for it and is always broke. His post still goes to his mother's house so I never see any bank statements  - he never gets turned on when i am naked in front of him even though i am attractive and I get a lot of attention from other men when i go out-he tells im sex obsessed when i bring up the issue or that he does not want to talk about it- he tells me that when you live with someone you don't have sex much-he ignores my tears when he turns me down for sex- if i sleep naked he stays well away from me and does not hug me - he has never kissed my body- he rarely kisses me and when he does its a peck - he hugs me but thats the only thing he does without me asking for it- sometimes he spends an hour in the toilet on his phone apparently doing a poo - i've never met any of his work mates apart from at the wedding- he is always checking my phone and emails but never lets me check his- he said i have too many friends on fb and gets me to delete people -he rarely takes me on dates or out   however there are positives too ... he calls me his best friend, he says he cant live without me, he makes me laugh so much every day, he makes food for me, tries to clean and hugs me alot.  I tried to take my own life last Monday after he refused to sleep with me. I don't know what came over me. He stopped me from stabbing myself and called my parents. My parents came and took me to live with them. I told my mother everything she was in shock and said I must not stay in the marriage. I told him that I wanted a divorce because I think he is gay. I haven't seen him for a week but speak to him via text every day, everyone in his family have texted me or called me to tell me he is not gay and  to stay/ try to make it work. I thought i could go without sex and that i just wanted a child but he couldn't even do it enough to give me one. I've been devastated and scared. He told me through out his relationship that if I leave he will kill himself so when i left I told his mother and father to look out for him as he may kill himself and that he might be gay. They replied our son is not fay you are sex obsessed. His mother said she will pay for counseling and pay all our debts off and to just go back to give it another shot. My mother told me to block them all so I did. I speak to him every day by text because i miss him  he is trying to persuade me to go back to him but i have refused. He has been my best friend for the past 15 months.  Do you think he is gay and am I making the right decision to divorce?  

  I'm sorry you need to be here, but this is the place you need to be.  Everything you've written says the answer to your two questions, "Do you think he is gay and am I making the right decision to divorce?", is yes and yes.  Yes, he's gay.  And yes, you are making the right decision to divorce.
   Both your husband and his parents are trying to pressure you back into the marriage because they do not want to accept that your husband is gay.  They are trying to make it seem as if what isn't your fault is your fault.  His mother is so desperate to deny her son is gay that she is even trying to bribe you (by saying she'll pay off your debts). 
    Many years ago when I was in college I needed some extra money, and I put an ad in the paper to do some housecleaning; I was hired by a woman who unbeknownst to me had a son with mental problems who was fixated on guns and knives and who went to school away from home at a boarding school.  One day I was cleaning the house and she left the house, leaving me alone with him in the house (he was home during vacation); when I went in his room to vacuum and dust he picked up a knife (he had a collection of weapons in there; why they allowed this is beyond me!), held it against my throat and threatened to kill me.  I managed to talk my way away from him, and escaped the house. 
   When I called the woman later to tell her what had happened and that I would never return, she tried to guilt me into returning.  "But I need you," she said. "It's almost entertaining season and I have a lot of parties and events planned.  He'll be going back to school soon and won't be here.  You can't let me down like that when you won't be in any danger."  She was actually angry at me because in her mind I had no reason to quit working for her. 
   I stuck to my decision not to return, but because what she said to me was loosely based on reason--her son would, after all, be away at school so I'd be safe and there could be no repeat of what he'd done--I felt guilty about and doubted my decision.  It took me many years to understand that a woman who would leave a son she knew to be disordered and disturbed alone with me was not a woman to be trusted, and whose attempts to bully me into returning by making what wasn't my fault seem as if it was were nothing I should feel guilty about. She had left me alone in the house with a son she knew was unbalanced and fixated on weapons and who threatened to kill me, and then she had tried to make me feel guilty for declining to put myself back in the place where my life had been threatened!  And she had tried to make me feel as if I were the one at fault for not wanting to return and choosing to protect myself!  In fact, she was lucky I was so young, shocked, and naive, and didn't think to call the police and have her son arrested and charged.
    I'm telling you this because you are in a similar scenario, and I want you to understand how easy it is to be swayed by those who are attacking you for your very self-protective and reasonable act of leaving your marriage in response to clear signs that your husband is gay, and so desperate to stay in the closet that he will sacrifice your health and happiness in order to do so.  He is, essentially, threatening your life, not with a knife, but by withholding intimacy and then attacking you for daring to want it.  The situation you're living in is killing your spirit, and you felt this so strongly you even resorted to desperate measures to demonstrate to him what living in your marriage is doing to you.  Your body was expressing your psychological trauma.  His mother, in calling you and saying that you are to blame because you are "sex obsessed," is doing exactly what that mother did to me all those years ago: she's displacing the blame away from her son onto you so she doesn't have to admit the reality.  Her son, your husband, is gay.  They are all, parents and son, desperate not to have to admit it, and that desperation has led to a disordered family dynamic that you have found yourself trapped in.
  I say listen to your mother.  She has your best interests at heart, and she can see clearly.   I would also say that you need to block contact not only with his mother, but with him.  He is engaged in trying to hoover you back to him, and will say anything to get you back to use you as his beard.  But once you're securely re-attached to him, the disparaging will start up all over again.  Please stay strong, stay safe, and get professional help from a therapist.
 

Last edited by OutofHisCloset (December 17, 2017 8:36 am)

Thank you so much for your advice I will see a therapist. Thank you  
 

Last edited by confusedbunny1 (December 17, 2017 8:40 am)