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September 28, 2018 7:27 am  #1151


Re: A gay ex-husband answers your questions

Violated,
 If my experience has anything transferable in it, I can tell you that you will come to be grateful that he is no longer yours to caretake.   It's a beautiful feeling of freedom.

 

September 29, 2018 9:51 am  #1152


Re: A gay ex-husband answers your questions

Thank you for posting OOHC, 4everdamaged, and Violated. In response to Violated's last post:

"Sean, thank you so much for your response. You always help me face my reality. Your statement, "He's no longer your responsibility," wow.........hit me. I always been his caretaker. But as sad as it is , I also realize that to him I am replaceable. Thanks for the reality check. I will keep you posted on my progress..........Onward." 

Given what you and others have shared Violated, namely this idea that your abusive/lying husband is somehow your best friend, a need to caretake, and trying to maintain some level of control over his relationships post-divorce, I'd suggest reading up on co-dependency.  If many gay-in-denial husbands, or soon to be ex-husbands, are narcissists, then logically their wives/partners could be co-dependents. Narcissists and co-dependents go together like peanut butter and jelly. I'd urge you to visit coda.org to read up on it. Just a suggestion my friend. 

Be well! 

 

September 29, 2018 7:34 pm  #1153


Re: A gay ex-husband answers your questions

I'm new to this forum and therefore have never posted...hope I'm doing it right.
I'm about 2 weeks into thinking my 58 year old husband (married 18 years) is gay. I have found him following gay porn and other similar stuff on Instagram. While I'm flabbergasted, I can't pretend that our marriage has been perfect. My husband was temporarily laid off about 4 years ago, and while he eventually got a job, he's never been the same since. The decisive, energetic, etc. guy I married was gone. Our marriage has suffered during this time; communication hasn't been great to say the least. In the last few months he's finally been closer to his original self, and ironically it's possibly because of his new found Iinstagram hobby.
This morning I told him that I know what we looks at on Instagram and that for the sake of our family (we have teens, 17 and 14) I think we should see a therapist. His response was "OK."
I'm so confused as it is. So much going thru my head. It took all the courage I had to broach the subject, and I'm astonished all I got was OK. I expected denial, anger, tears...something.
I'm not even sure what I'm asking entirely.... Is his OK just a way to shut me up so he doesn't have to talk about this right now? Is it relief on his part that perhaps the cat is out of the bag? Part of me is ticked off because I feel I've opened the door for him, but he's not walking through it by talking to me. Should I push it; ask more or wait until I can get us to a therapist?
I'm just so confused and would love some insight from others with similar stories...
 

 

September 29, 2018 11:43 pm  #1154


Re: A gay ex-husband answers your questions

Sean, thanks for your info on co-dependency. I appreciate your insight. I never viewed myself as a co-dependent.....But.....could be.  I probably am......I'll let you know. Going to site now.

 

September 30, 2018 12:01 am  #1155


Re: A gay ex-husband answers your questions

Good day Samatha and welcome, although I'm very sorry you've found yourself here. In response to your post:

1. I'm new to this forum and therefore have never posted...hope I'm doing it right.

There is no right nor wrong my friend. We're all just sharing and doing our best. 

2. I'm about 2 weeks into thinking my 58 year old husband (married 18 years) is gay. I have found him following gay porn and other similar stuff on Instagram. While I'm flabbergasted, I can't pretend that our marriage has been perfect.

I'm so sorry. I've often referred to this as "discovery" or a time period when you've caught your husband surfing gay porn or having sex with men. Discovery can be one of the most challenging times for a straight spouse. Why? Because there is often a long period of suspicion before she starts investigating. So I'd suggest you share your feelings here, on your own forum thread, with a therapist, or with close friends/family. Now is not the time to deal with this alone.  

3. My husband was temporarily laid off about 4 years ago, and while he eventually got a job, he's never been the same since. The decisive, energetic, etc. guy I married was gone. Our marriage has suffered during this time; communication hasn't been great to say the least. In the last few months he's finally been closer to his original self, and ironically it's possibly because of his new found Instagram hobby.


This sounds like a very challenging time for you as well. Can you share more about how your marriage has suffered?  

4. This morning I told him that I know what we looks at on Instagram and that for the sake of our family (we have teens, 17 and 14) I think we should see a therapist. His response was "OK."


That took a lot of courage to confront him like that. Most gay/straight couples try therapy together, often with mixed results. Sadly, men who have hidden their sexuality for most of their lives sometimes suffer from narcissistic personality disorder (or "NPD"). This means they are black-belt manipulators, entirely capable of manipulating mental health professionals as well. So what's my point? I'd urge you to first attend individual counselling to ensure that you're getting the help you need as well. In couples therapy, straight spouses often end up getting blamed for most of the problems gay or gay-in-denial husbands have caused. So this is just a word of caution Samatha - please don't forget to focus on yourself and your needs as well.  

5. I'm so confused as it is. So much going thru my head. It took all the courage I had to broach the subject, and I'm astonished all I got was OK. I expected denial, anger, tears...something.


I don't have a lot of detail but this sounds a bit like my own reaction when my (then) wife confronted me. I too went through a period of depression before coming out. When confronted, my reaction was more exhausted relief than anything else. I was relieved that this secret I'd hidden my whole life was finally out. 

6. I'm not even sure what I'm asking entirely.... Is his OK just a way to shut me up so he doesn't have to talk about this right now? Is it relief on his part that perhaps the cat is out of the bag? Part of me is ticked off because I feel I've opened the door for him, but he's not walking through it by talking to me. Should I push it; ask more or wait until I can get us to a therapist?

I can't speculate as to his motivations nor feelings. As I wrote above, his reaction may be relief that hiding his true sexuality is now over. I understand your anger because you feel as though you might have opened a (pink) Pandora's box. As for getting "us" to a therapist, again I'd urge you to seek individual counseling before trying couples counseling. Why? I reckon you both need to work through a lot of emotions before you're ready to discuss what this means for your marriage & family. 

7. I'm just so confused and would love some insight from others with similar stories...

Again I'm very sorry that you've found yourself here my friend. Please keep posting so that the kind and supportive members here can share their own stories and insights. You might also find that by posting regularly here, you'll start to understand emotions and events that you might have previously denied or misunderstood.

I hope that helps in some way. Be well!  

Last edited by Sean (September 30, 2018 12:04 am)

 

October 1, 2018 7:02 pm  #1156


Re: A gay ex-husband answers your questions

Hi Sean. I am posting the link to my story as I’m interested in your thoughts.

I also posed the question of what you think about gay literature as opposed to gay porn. He’s looked and read both but this bout of searching has all been gay lit. That I’ve been able see anyway. It seems more intimate to me. Would like to know your thoughts.

Also, the progression in our sex life from it being enough for me to embody his fantasies but when I lost interest and avoided this, he has moved on to gay lit and porn exclusively. I don’t see him reading a lot of mistress/sub stories!!

Thank you in advance. Your experience on here is invaluable to us Str8 spouses.

I’ve posted under Support thread. Old Member - TGT again.

Thank you.

 

October 1, 2018 7:19 pm  #1157


Re: A gay ex-husband answers your questions

I have been married 26 years and my husband told me he is gay. More likely bisexual but for the last five years the gay urges are stronger. Our marriage has suffered a lot because we have a mentally ill daughter. The last 2 years of my life have been hell. My life was pretty simple and drama free before that. Since the mental illness has been hard on us all we agree to wait for my son to get of of high school before we divorce and disclose the truth. My daughter is now away from us in a good program but we have financial debt with that. I am just worried I will never find love again. Thanks for listening.

 

October 1, 2018 7:37 pm  #1158


Re: A gay ex-husband answers your questions

Hey Samantha, I'm not on here too often but I saw your post and I'm butting in on point #5 and #6 above.  I opened the door to conversation almost 3 years ago.  I am still getting nothing.  I believe my husband was panicked at first that I knew and he was relieved that I didn't fly off the handle or grab the kids and run.  Which led me to just living with the elephant in the room for the last 3 years.  I've tried to approach the subject gently and forcefully and nothing has worked.  He's quite content to leave it where it is so I laid out the rules and made him listen.  No cheating, that sex with the same gender is cheating.  (believe it or not somehow he had decided it wasn't)   If he wants to explore sex with others than he needs to discuss it with me first, that there will be rules.  That if he breaks these rules I'm out.  I have to trust that he's following them and I have no reason right now to believe he's not.  I'm sorry that you're here and I can't say that it is easy.   If my kids were older I probably wouldn't have lasted as long as I have.  Not just the gay/bi thing but for other reasons as well.  
Take care
Vicky


 
 

October 2, 2018 12:05 am  #1159


Re: A gay ex-husband answers your questions

Sean wrote:

Required reading from Detour (full thread here: http://straightspouse.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?id=1297): 

"In my humble opinion, the translation to the "I'm bisexual but will never act on this" statement, well, this equals..."I do not care if I am hurting you, this is all about me, seriously, you are not my everything, behind your back I am looking at men, working to fit into this newfound identity.  This is my excuse for never really being present with you, but instead looking past you and not fully appreciating your voice, your heart, your love or place in my life."  There comes a point, however, that this can no longer be about them, who they are attracted to, if they are with us or not, there comes a point to where we must take full responsibility for ourselves and our path forward.  I mean, look at how much time we are fretting over this issue...we are placing someone else's confusion under a microscope, looking for a truth that may always be on the other side of what is in view. [color=#000000]One day I woke up, announced to my H (declaring that he owns his own baggage and that I was no longer carrying that weight for him) and decided to really get busy in therapy.  No more games, there is no time for games and time is so very precious to me...I deserve a good life filled with happy and that is what I'm aiming for. So here's the thing... I've changed.  I see my own value and I matter.  To be absolutely honest, I do NOT want a relationship with anyone right now.  I do not wish to fall into any sort of distraction away from finding myself.  I'm working on my self esteem, the why I have enabled just about everyone in my life to walk all over me and I'm trying new hobbies, I've adopted a new look and a new approach at everything.  Do you know what?  I've taken on the idea that I want to live today that makes yesterday jealous.  I'm working to erase an unhealthy pattern where I'm waiting for him to get his act together.  I'm done waiting, that limbo is no place to live. As for my H, this all goes so much deeper than an announcement on how he identifies.  I mean honestly, so what, right?  Big deal.  Bi is an excuse...a way to cast a shadow over a marriage that should reflect both people being in it at 100%.  That excuse gives them a way to play us and everyone who is effected by our relationship, including our children.  They have an excuse to check out, to be moody, make everything they do and say have a double meaning...or not...to have everything revolve around them.  That works to keep us off balance and to impose a net over us and our existence.  They fantasize while believing the grass is greener on the other side of the fence when in the end, this has more to do with their inability to get real about life and to be connected to anyone. 

Wow. Just wow. This mirrors where I am after years of flailing and internalising my anguish. It cuts through all the smoke and mirrors of explanations, denial, promises, and fog.

Thank you.

 

October 2, 2018 1:27 am  #1160


Re: A gay ex-husband answers your questions

Thanks everyone for sharing. In reply: 

1. PennyD: I also posed the question of what you think about gay literature as opposed to gay porn. He’s looked and read both but this bout of searching has all been gay lit. That I’ve been able see anyway. It seems more intimate to me. Would like to know your thoughts. Also, the progression in our sex life from it being enough for me to embody his fantasies but when I lost interest and avoided this, he has moved on to gay lit and porn exclusively. I don’t see him reading a lot of mistress/sub stories!!

Thanks for writing Penny. In response to your question, I reckon gay literature vs gay porn sounds like an alcoholic trying to distinguish between vodka and gin. So what's my point? An alcoholic just wants to get drunk, so it doesn't really matter what she's drinking. My point is that straight men don't watch gay porn and read gay erotica; but gay men do. I've been posting here for over a year and there seems to be a common progression in gay/straight marriages. And that progression consists of, following discovery, both the gay & straight spouses try to minimize or bargain with a simple truth: the husband is gay. That progression often sounds a bit like this: 

- I found gay porn on his computer but he said it was just a pop up. 
- I found gay porn on his computer again but he promised to never watch it again. 
- I found out he had sex with another man, but he said it happened just once.
- I found out he had sex with several men, but he claims his same-sex attraction comes from childhood abuse.
- He now claims to be bisexual and wants to open up our marriage. But just wants sex with men once a month. 

Whether your husband watches porn or reads porn is a moot point my friend. The more important points are that your husband is gay and as a gay man has zero interest in sex with women. As you so poignantly shared:

"I realised that either he doesn’t care about me or he can’t help himself because he’s gay - either scenario doesn’t look good for me. I’ve decided to choose me. And it’s about time."

Good for you! 

2. Vicky wrote: Hey Samantha, I'm not on here too often but I saw your post and I'm butting in on point #5 and #6 above.  I opened the door to [the] conversation almost 3 years ago.  I am still getting nothing.  I believe my husband was panicked at first that I knew and he was relieved that I didn't fly off the handle or grab the kids and run.  Which led me to just living with the elephant in the room for the last 3 years.  I've tried to approach the subject gently and forcefully and nothing has worked.  He's quite content to leave it where it is so I laid out the rules and made him listen.  No cheating, that sex with the same gender is cheating.  (Believe it or not somehow he had decided it wasn't)   If he wants to explore sex with others than he needs to discuss it with me first, that there will be rules.  That if he breaks these rules I'm out.  I have to trust that he's following them and I have no reason right now to believe he's not.  I'm sorry that you're here and I can't say that it is easy.   If my kids were older I probably wouldn't have lasted as long as I have.  Not just the gay/bi thing but for other reasons as well.​

Thank you for sharing Vicky. I'm glad (and also sad) to see you back my friend. You wrote a few things that struck me, namely:

"So I laid out the rules and made him listen."
"If he breaks these rules I'm out. I have to trust that he's following them..."
"I've tried to approach the subject gently and forcefully and nothing has worked." 

I've read similar posts from countless straight wives. After years of suspicion, when faced with the stark reality that their husbands are indeed gay, straight spouses' reactions seem to follow a pattern:

- Grudging acceptance that he may be "bisexual" but "not 100% gay" 
- Trying to control his homosexuality through rules: "no more porn; no more Craigslist; no more cheating." 
- Insisting on couples therapy.
- Constantly pushing him to admit he's gay.

The reality is that men who have been closeted for decades are unlikely to just blurt out "I'm gay" to the women we married solely to hide our homosexuality. While many gay-in-denial husbands are toxic narcissists (if not monsters), I reckon most of us have genuine feelings for the women we marry. Saying "I'm gay and our marriage is a lie" to the mother of our children is a very tall order indeed, particularly when confronted with the consequences of such an admission: divorce. I hope this doesn't come across as blame shifting. Gay husbands like me are 100% to blame for lying, cheating, and minimizing their behaviour. The point I'm trying to make is that even before discovery of gay porn or cheating, I reckon most gay/straight couples go through years of unhappiness. The story I most often read goes something like this: "We're best friends but our relationship has never been very sexual. He never seemed interested, I always initiated, and now we haven't had sex in years." I reckon there is often a limbo stage when the couple is no longer having sex, no longer communicating, and they just appear to be waiting for something to happen. Vicky you shared that your limbo stage has lasted 3 years, mine lasted about 18 months. In my experience, it was a time when we too thought we'd stay together "for the kids" but looking back I think we were just scared to accept our marriage was truly over. 

3. Shellshocked wrote: I have been married 26 years and my husband told me he is gay. More likely bisexual but for the last five years the gay urges are stronger. Our marriage has suffered a lot because we have a mentally ill daughter. The last 2 years of my life have been hell. My life was pretty simple and drama free before that. Since the mental illness has been hard on us all we agree to wait for my son to get of of high school before we divorce and disclose the truth. My daughter is now away from us in a good program but we have financial debt with that. I am just worried I will never find love again. Thanks for listening.​
 
Thanks for writing Shellshocked (SS), although I'm very sorry you're struggling my friend. I understand your situation is tumultuous, but please make yourself and your own well-being a priority. Unlike most straight spouses, your husband has admitted to being gay. But this struck me: "...my husband told me he is gay. More likely bisexual but for the last five years the gay urges are stronger." Again this smacks of bargaining. When a person is gay, he/she is attracted to the same sex.  It's not an urge. It's who I am. Even though I married a woman to conform while hiding my own homosexuality, I've now accepted that my attraction and need to be in a relationship with another man is hard-wired. So what's my point?

As I've shared in previous posts, I reckon that once a straight spouse starts posting here, whether she accepts it or not, her marriage is over. (I apologize for that slap but after 18 months of posting here, the facts are undeniable.) Whether the issue is a gay husband, money problems, or a lack of intimacy, most couples try to save their relationships before separation & divorce. After all, we have been taught that marriage is a life-long commitment worth saving...particularly when children are involved. So we don't just walk away. Straight spouses are an incredibly tenacious group. Before discovering their husbands are gay, most straight wives have already spent decades suffering through dry kisses, squirmy hugs, and mechanical sex. Once they discover gay porn or cheating, I reckon it's almost a relief because they now know the root cause of their relationship problems..."It's him and not me!" Far from being deterred, after discovery straight wives often roll up their sleeves and get down to work. And by getting to work I mean they double their efforts to fix husbands with "same sex attraction." This often means couples therapy, lots of rules, greater supervision, and perhaps even greater creativity in the bedroom. Sadly, while she does everything (yet again) to save the relationship, the gay-in-denial (GID) husband eventually withdraws even more. He becomes more depressed, more addicted to porn, or he cheats more often. If most gay (or GID) husbands are like me, we secretly want out of our gay/straight marriages because playing straight is slowly killing us. I'm not trying to explain away a gay husband's emotional abuse, lying, nor cheating. I'm simply stating that once that (pink) cat is out of the bag, there is no going back. There eventually comes a point when the straight spouse realizes three things: first, her husband is 100% gay; second, she's the only one trying to save the relationship; and third, gay men can't satisfy straight women, on any level.

Gay/straight marriages simply don't work. Gay men will only find fulfillment with other gay men and straight wives need straight men. To deny this simple truth means a lifetime of unhappiness. I know because I tried for decades to make my own gay/straight marriage work. As Penny shared: "I realised that either he doesn’t care about me or he can’t help himself because he’s gay - either scenario doesn’t look good for me. I’ve decided to choose me. And it’s about time." 

Thanks for reading friends. I hope that helps. Be well! 

 

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