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April 22, 2020 10:46 am  #51


Re: I'm lost and don't know what to do or think.

Yes, I would say that my family is sympathetic. They know that I am going through a lot right now. I have one sister that is more understanding than my Mom and other sister. The other sister wants me to be more sympathetic and try harder with my husband. I can't do that because I am the only one who has put forth any effort in 20 years and Im emotionally tapped out. The understanding sister believes that I have found convincing evidence that my husband might be gay. I think my Mom doesn’t want to think about that possibility, because this is the father of her grandchildren. Everyone wants the marriage to continue but would support me if a divorce occurred. 

It's interesting that you and your ex stopped having sex in your 40's. I'm 44 and he is 3 years older than me. I am sure that my husband has not talked to my family about anything.

You make a good point about denial.

 

April 22, 2020 2:19 pm  #52


Re: I'm lost and don't know what to do or think.

okay that's not too bad.  You know I wanted to leave my ex right at the beginning and my mom said something about not switching partners and I stayed and I have often thought back to that moment - mothers have such an influence on us don't they.  My mom was utterly delightful mother she is gone now and I still miss her a lot.  She finally set me a stellar good example by divorcing my father after 57 years of marriage.  She finally realised the trouble she was in by getting old and vulnerable with a narcissistic spouse and made it out of there. (tough times were ahead but she never regretted it). and she finally changed her mind about my ex she saw through him before I did and went from liking him to really not wanting him near her.  But back then she thought he was really nice and treated me well.

and it's very good to have a sister who is believing you about him being gay.  Good for her.  She's the one to be talking with most right now, she might be able to explain it to the rest of the family a bit for you.  I am glad you found us here though - it is so hard when no one believes in you.  we need that corroboration of what we see and it's not going to come from the one you would normally look to - denial is in itself abusive because it is attacking your belief in your own perceptions - how can I be seeing a kitten on the windowsill when it isn't there, and you check to see why you got it wrong, oh the shape of that vase and the bowl next to it caught my eye and looked like a kitten for a moment.  Or oh there really is a kitten there,

I remember this time I tried to lie to my friend about smoking.  no I haven't been smoking, then why can I smell it and I denied it again oh it must have come from outside and she tried again and when I denied again I saw the confusion, the self doubt growing in her eyes and I confessed straight away.  It is distressing for any of us to have our reality denied.

wishing you all the best, Lily

 

April 25, 2020 11:48 am  #53


Re: I'm lost and don't know what to do or think.

You are right about our reality being denied being distressing. I came home from the grocery store, and one of the first things that my husband said to me when I got home was, “Guess what? I got a package from Steve!” Steve is his gay friend who I have referenced in these posts before. The one that he FaceTimed a few weeks back. I feel like he rushes to tell me these things, like when he told me he was going to FaceTime him, because he believes that if he tells me everything then he’s not hiding anything. Then I know everything, and can’t accuse him of anything. He received a book from “Steve” and my husband has been reading it all morning. He has also been in a really good mood today. I encourage his relationship with Steve and I feigned excitement over him receiving a book from him because I need this to happen. I’ve lived most of my life with my husband and feeling ignored and devalued and not cherished. I’m honestly empty. Drained. I want his relationship with Steve to progress because I want more proof or because I want my husband to come out to me, so that I can move on with the rest of my life. I know that if I were to try to move on with my life now, that I would be considered the “bad guy” because I don’t have concrete evidence that they are more than friends. My husband would just accuse me and say that he was honest with me about everything. I pray every day because I don’t know what else to do.

     Thread Starter
 

April 25, 2020 3:05 pm  #54


Re: I'm lost and don't know what to do or think.

The cynic in me thinks that if you wait until your husband comes out to you you will be waiting until Kingdom Come.
 

 

April 25, 2020 4:12 pm  #55


Re: I'm lost and don't know what to do or think.

Yes, it’s like Waiting for Godot.

Am guessing Steve is the latest in a long line of male sex partners whom he has successfully hidden from you.  Am guessing he has a circle of gay friends he gushes to in person about new crushes. They’re not around now. That’s your role in quarantine. 

Leaving him without proof may be like tearing off  a bandaid that’s stuck to a wound - it hurts like h3ll to disappoint your kids, your family doesn’t understand, your husband will love bomb you while putting you down for wrecking the family, your husband will probably slander you to anyone who will listen, among other painful things. You should gauge your mental strength to see if you can withstand the emotional abuse on steroids.

However, leaving is doable if you prepare yourself psychologically & financially.  Financials are extremely important during this time; protect yourself so he doesn’t steal your money & sabotage your future. You can give yourself a year or two. I would keep these plans secret if you intend to go this route.

I am sorry to see you suffering. You deserve better. This guy is a wolf in sheep’s clothing. I would not trust him for one more second.


No - It's not too late. It's not hopeless. Even there, there's something I can do. I just have to find the will. Ikiru (1952), film directed by Akira Kurosawa 
 

April 26, 2020 11:55 am  #56


Re: I'm lost and don't know what to do or think.

My husband and I got in an argument last night. As I have mentioned before, he still wants to have sex, but literally only shows me any kind of sexual touch once we are in bed, never during the day. Our argument started because he was touching my leg in bed, and he asked if I liked having my leg rubbed. I responded with, “yes, why are you asking?” He said, “I just wanted to make sure. I don’t know what you like.” I made a comment about how it was sad that after 23 years of marriage that he doesn’t know what I like or whether or not I like my legs being touched. That is when the blame game began and the argument. He says that I am closed off and don’t always like to be touched, which I admit is probably accurate of the last few months but not true of our entire marriage. He says that I act like I’m the one who is always rejected but really its him being rejected and not me. I gave him examples of times when I was rejected but he had excuses for all of them. I told him he is allowed to touch me sexually during the day as much as he wants. I have told him this before. He acts like all this is new news to him. He said, “I didn’t know I could touch you whenever and however I want, I didn’t think that was or should be allowed.” I know what he’s saying, no I don’t want to be poked and prodded and treated disrespectfully but yes, I am your wife, so feel free to do whatever. I don’t know. I don’t know if it’s him or me. In some ways, he’s right, but not completely. My husband is a nice person, and I know he loves me in his way, so why would he do this to me? Why would he intentionally confuse me? Or is he doing it unintentionally? Does he really think that it’s me? That I’m the issue. I don’t know. I feel like shit.

     Thread Starter
 

April 26, 2020 12:06 pm  #57


Re: I'm lost and don't know what to do or think.

MJM017 and OOHC
Thank you for your thoughts. I am currently the only one working full time so financially I can support myself. Im just in a complete state of confusion right now. Maybe I don't belong on this board. I don't think my husband has had sex with men but maybe I just don't want to think about it. Or maybe he hasn't had sex with men but is still confused about his sexuality. Maybe it is me. Maybe I have issues. I am unwell right now.

     Thread Starter
 

April 26, 2020 12:11 pm  #58


Re: I'm lost and don't know what to do or think.

I thought the issue here wasn't about whether YOU liked sex, but about HIS sexuality.  There is no point in getting in a back and forth argument in which  he can "reverse victim and offender"--part of the DARVO (deny, attack, reverse victim and offender) tactics of abuse--to deflect from the real issue.  So of course you feel like shit.  Your husband has you whirling in circles.

 

Last edited by OutofHisCloset (April 26, 2020 12:12 pm)

 

April 26, 2020 12:22 pm  #59


Re: I'm lost and don't know what to do or think.

Karis,
    Most of us are completely bamboozled by the kinds of the mental gymnastics employed by a closeted person in denial, and we are undermined by the resultant verbal attacks that come when the person feels as if his beard is in danger of uncovering the truth--and making him face the truth about himself.   They are masters at sowing confusion in us, and they know exactly what buttons to push.  When I finally began to see through my husband's tactics, I used to find myself thinking "Your Jedi mind tricks don't work on me any more."  If you think of what your husband is doing as muddying the waters and distracting you from the real issue--his increasingly obvious fixation on Steve and their online dalliance--it might be easier for you not to engage, which only throws you for a loop and makes you doubt your perception and sanity, and makes you think you are in the wrong.  
   
 
  

Last edited by OutofHisCloset (April 26, 2020 12:23 pm)

 

April 26, 2020 1:05 pm  #60


Re: I'm lost and don't know what to do or think.

Karis I sent you a private message.  You can find it in your inbox, above.

 

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