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December 1, 2017 7:35 pm  #11

Re: Finding the courage

Thank you for the continued support!  He wants to talk on Sunday and claims he wants to open up to me more and will feel better. He still doesn’t think that my mind is made up (and for slight seconds I don’t know either). He isnt a bad person I really don’t even feel much anger towards him I just don’t understand it.. I feel like from me reading all your stories and advice I understand what he’s going through more than he even does.

He still says he can make me happy and that he doesn’t even think about that stuff anymore but yet I can never get him to fully open up about what “that stuff” or TGT as I see you guys say, means to him. I know he’s also worried about his citizenship status. I don’t really care about it that’s his problem.. but today he said he wants to use our attorney thatt we used to file the papers for him to be a permanent resident (which is still pending and we haven’t even completed the process) to take care of our divorce. I told him I didn’t want to even deal with an attorney we have nothing to divide between us but he wants to do it the right way and he mentioned how he might not even Be able to visit the US again- not my problem! I looked into the annulment side because in my state I’d have to either say it was fraud on his part(which I feel like I have a case because TGT was more than what he initially lead me to believe before the marriage) and also i don’t know what legally “consummate” means but I don’t feel like we ever did that, it’s been Almost 6 months and the most we had was like 10 seconds and no ejaculation besides foreplay. But that is not the route I wanted to go because I don’t want it to get messy. And if he thinks we should use an attorney obviously he’s going to ask WHY and my husband will not be in a good situation since he’s not a citizen. But he doesn’t see it that way.

So I told him we need the weekend apart and on Sunday we can talk one last time and I will hear him out- but 99.9% in my heart I already know no matter what he says on Sunday I just can’t do it. I don’t even desire him anymore. I used to be attracted to him and want him but after so long of no physical connection between us it just has faded away. But I hate that he always says how he wants to work on it and blah blah blah like there’s nothing to work on. He tugged at my heart today by saying he can’t imagine his life without me.. though I’m sure that’s not true. Trying to stay focused and driven to get out of this even though it’s hard.


December 2, 2017 7:16 am  #12

Re: Finding the courage

You should have an attorney who represents only you because this conversation shows that he is going to cling to you for dear life and try to keep you in his immigration case. On his part marrying you indeed may have been a sham to get residency and the authorities will ask a lot of questions of the spouse to try to screen out those who married only for this purpose. Answers are under oath with penalties for false statements..

You did not marry him as a party to contrivance and the less involvement you have in his immigration case going forward the better for you. His attorney likely is going to want you to stay married and back him up, not blurt out around immigration that you found evidence  that he is attracted to men and that you believe were deceived into this marriage that you want to exit!

 I doubt that  with his immigration case pending your husband is going to consent to a divorce but if you have an attorney representing you s/he should be able to get you out of the marriage whether he cooperates or not. S/he can advise you about divorce versus annulment under your state's laws. Whichever way you go under state law you still would need to seek a religious annulment if that is
part of your religious tradition so that should not be the determining factor.

Stay strong!

Try Gardening. It'll keep you grounded.

December 2, 2017 7:48 am  #13

Re: Finding the courage

   Because you wrote earlier to say that he'd been violent, grabbing you by the collar of your shirt and punching holes in the wall, I would urge you not to meet with him in private, because he is going to be feeling desperate, both about maintaining his secret and his immigration status. 
 Ideally I'd say to meet with him in an official setting with a third party present--a counselor, a clergy person--but if that's not possible, at the very least meet with him in a public place, somewhere you will be observed by other people: a coffee shop, say.   Also make sure you alert someone else in your life that you are planning to meet, and make sure he knows that others know you will be meeting.  If you need a way to "end" the meeting, pre-arrange for someone else to call you at a specified time.  
  I'd also suggest that before your meeting you prepare yourself mentally.  Choose a phrase for yourself that you can repeat for yourself to help you stay centered. It would also be useful for you to run though your meeting beforehand in your imagination, and in that scenario in your head imagine yourself staying strong. In the meeting itself, remember to breathe, deliberately, in and out, several times, or as long as you need to stay calm, if what he's saying is disturbing or you need time to think. 
 Good luck.


December 4, 2017 4:41 pm  #14

Re: Finding the courage

 Can you tell us how your meeting went?  Are you safe and well?


December 4, 2017 5:01 pm  #15

Re: Finding the courage


We'd really like to hear from you - we're concerned for your safety.  Maybe you're not, but we don't like that he grabbed you by the collar and punched a hole in the wall.  That's proof that he's prone to impulsive behavior.  Which means that any time he feels angry or confused, he can lose control.

Definitely need an update.


P.S. - You are not "giving up" on your marriage - or even him.  You are deciding that you don't need to stay married to someone who has been actively deceiving you since before you were married.  That's NOT "giving up".  He'll tell you that it is, because he's trying to get you to stay any way that he can - even by guilt.  If you need to guilt someone to stay, you don't have their heart.  He might not care about that, though - he's got alterior motives.  So he'll try to get you to do what he wants in ANY way that works - because it suits his need.  Please be aware of that during any future conversations.

You are not required to set yourself on fire to keep other people warm.

December 4, 2017 5:11 pm  #16

Re: Finding the courage

Hello thanks for checking I am safe and doing fine. The weekend didn’t go as planned. I thought he would distance himself and move out but he didn’t. He instead opened up to me more and explained that because of his low confidence his whole life and growing up in a small home with his older siblings often bringing girls home and sleeping with them in the same room as him that he was exposed early on and became addicted to porn which he still is( he has never told me this before) I knew he was very inexperienced and has low self esteem and I do believe that he hasn’t been with any men and really not many women either. He has kept to himself inside his own head his whole life and resorted to porn and masturbating and admits he is addicted. He claims because of this addiction the porn world has opened his eyes to so much. He says when we try to be intimate he just doesn’t know how and he’s not used relying on someone’ else to please him since he has been doing it by himself his whole life. He asked for my help and support for him to get over this addiction. I ask why now do you finally tell me this and he says he was so embarrassed it’s something he’s never told anyone. I am not sure what my next move is. I think honestly I could work through this if It didn’t have the male factor in it. That is the part that is so hard for me to get past. I have had a rough couple of weeks and I need to just calm down and really give it some time to see how I feel. I have been honest with him and told him I don’t know what my decision is and He accepts that.  I will keep you guys updated in the upcoming weeks as to what happens.

Last edited by Evergreen (December 4, 2017 5:13 pm)

     Thread Starter

December 4, 2017 5:18 pm  #17

Re: Finding the courage

Oh Evergreen, I heard exactly this addiction, relying on masturbation, not knowing what to do in a sexual situation with me, confused between masturbation, porn and sexual release.

It's.all.rubbish. Straight men don't do this, they are so overwhelmed by wanting sex with girls that they go for it. And even if he failed to get girls into bed as a youngster...once he had you in his bed he would have hardly contained himself!

It's deflection. Most of us here have heard all this nonsense from our gids.


December 11, 2017 1:27 pm  #18

Re: Finding the courage


He's coming up with one excuse after the other.  The first thing you saw had no excuse - he wasn't pursuing sex at all with you early on.  You thought it was refreshing (I remember thinking that myself with my ex).  So what you did was you took that odd situation and decided that although it was a red flag, it was okay - because the opposite of what he was doing didn't make you feel wanted in other ways.  As with anything in life, there has to be balance - for a relationship between a man and woman to be good and healthy, there has to be a balance between "he wants me for my body" and "he likes other things about me".  You should have BOTH - not just one.  One or the other isn't enough.  Not healthy, not fulfilling, etc.  But you at the time decided to look at his behavior as a good thing - it mean he wasn't shallow.  And that he was being respectful and that he liked/loved you for who you really are, not just a conglomeration of your body parts.  We all want that.  But normal, straight men have enough urge for women that when they find one that they truly love, their sex drive skyrockets and they just want to physically express that love and adoration.  Anyway - that was your first red flag.

Next he's not initiating sex very often, it's largely devoid of passion, he's having issues with erections and completion, and you can see him mentally escaping to another place in order to keep himself excited.  He gives you an excuse - he's just no that experienced.  Most straight men would never admit to this - they'd just get more experience (with you!).  They don't want to be seen as inadequate in any way - especially in supporting their woman financially, or pleasing her intimately.  It goes straight to their manhood.  But he has no issue with admitting that he doesn't know what he's doing.  It's an excuse to buy him time - and your pity.  So that's two.  You made the excuse for the lack of sex initially (or rather, just accepted it without question).  HE made the second excuse - lack of experience.

Then comes excuse #3 - the doctor supposedly proclaiming that he's stressed out and depressed.  IF the doctor said that, it's because he told the doctor he's stressed out and depressed.  It might even be true.  He could be stressed out because he has to perform when he's not excited by females, and so he doesn't know how to fake it (because it's hard to fake).  Or depressed because he's living a lie and can't be with men like he truly wishes to be.  Regardless, he gives you a different excuse.  It used to be that he was inexperienced.  Now it's that he's stressed and depressed.  Most men (especially younger ones) will use sex as a pressure release value when they're stressed, by the way.

You find evidence of him looking for sex with other men.  His excuse is that he doesn't know what that's about.  But having found a real profile, you must know that's not true.  Putting this information together with his lack of desire toward you should paint a picture for you - it's not about you - he likes men.  But his words pull you back in.  He tells you how much he loves you and wants to be with you, and how he doesn't think about those things "anymore".  Like it was six years ago or something.  It had been weeks/months.  He didn't quit - he got caught.  KNOW that he was out there sleeping with these men that he was seeking.  There is no straight man that will put out such ads just out of curiosity.  Men are all straight to the finish line when it comes to sex.  It's women who slow them down.  Two men have NO ONE to slow them down.  They can say "Hi" and be right in the hotel room within minutes - and both be comfortable with that.  They don't need time to get to know each other, and to make sure that they're both in it for the same reason - they ARE both in it for the same reason - SEX.  They both know this, and they're cool with it.  They couldn't care less if they ever see each other again.  They got what they wanted.

Anyway,..... you see evidence of him searching for others for sex when he's giving you less than stellar performances.  My ex did that - I found him online searching for gay males in the area.  I'd been begging him for more sex and intimacy for years, and here he was, telling me he just didn't have that high of a drive, but here he was, trying to give to someone else what I so desperately wanted?  I was livid, to say the least.  It wasn't any different than if he'd cheated on me with a female, in my opinion.  It was worse, as a matter of fact.  How DARE you give me so little of what I want and need that you will watch me cry over feeling rejected, all the time acting like it's just a mismatch of drive that's the issue.  When you HAD the drive, just not for ME.  That's bullshit.

So he straightens out for a while.  Or he just gets better at hiding so that you don't find anything for a while.  He tries to look open and honest, but even after just a bit, it becomes obvious that he's being sneaky again.  So he thinks that you're dumb enough to believe that if he appears honest even for a little bit, that's enough to trick you.  I would be insulted that he thinks you're THAT naive.  Meanwhile, your issue isn't going away.

THEN you find him doing this shit again.  NOW his excuse is that he's addicted to porn and self-pleasure.  That he needs your help in order to get through this.  He makes you part of the team, so that you are busy fighting for him.  That should tie you up for a while.

He's one excuse after the other, evergreen.  He is inexperienced.  Then he's stressed and depressed.  Now he's got past trauma and is addicted to porn and self pleasure.  It's ALL a giant lie, evergreen.  It's all smoke and mirrors.  You know the truth.  He's hoping that you have enough naivete and blind trust to believe him over yourself.  He's counting on it.  And he'll just keep this game going as long as you'll let him.  He's gay, hon.  He's cheating.  He's using you.  The only one that's going to stop this is you.  He'll just keep on going at it until the jig is up.  He's hoping that's years from now - when he has his greencard and doesn't need a woman any longer.

Don't get all hung up on the "buts"; "But.... he loves my family!"  So?  Maybe they're awesome and anyone would love them.  "But..... they love him, too!"  Well of course they do - they will love whomever makes you happy.  And if he's duping YOU, then how hard is it to dupe everyone around you, too?  Not as difficult as it should be to fool you.  So if he's charming enough to do that, then it's not that big of a talent to do so for others, too.  "But it doesn't FEEL like he's taking advantage of me."  Okay, so it doesn't feel like it.  That's exactly how he wants it to feel.  He's worked very hard to make it not feel that way.  "But..... aren't I giving up on him during his greatest trial?"  No, no you're not.  You're deciding to stop actively letting someone take advantage of you.  "But..... what will happen to him if we get divorced?"  I don't know.  He'll likely find someone new to take advantage of.  It's what they do.  He'll figure it out.  He's not going to die in a gutter.  He's smarter than that.  He was smart enough to orchestrate this whole thing even though he's not attracted to women.  He'll figure it out, trust me.

And don't get hung up on how it makes YOU look, either.  I think one of our biggest issues can be admitting that we made a poor choice.  Letting this go means admitting that we made a poor choice, and we feel like we look dumb.  Okay, maybe we did.  We did it because we were tricked.  So there's really no shame in that.  But..... even if you can't get past that, think of how much WORSE it looks to STAY with someone that you DO know is a poor choice?  Before you didn't know you were making a poor choice.  NOW you KNOW.  Staying beyond that point is much worse looking than having been duped for a period of time.

Trust yourself, evergreen.  Value yourself enough to know that this isn't going to make you happy.  And that you need to walk away.  Be proud that you found out before you became further entangled with property and children.  You're smart enough to know the truth, and do what you need to do with it.  Stop listening to him - his words aren't matching his desire level for you, or his actions with seeking other men.  When someone shows you who they really are, believe them.


Last edited by Kel (December 11, 2017 1:42 pm)

You are not required to set yourself on fire to keep other people warm.

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