OurPath (formerly SSN) Open Forum / How to talk with him

**Posted by Epiphany** January 10, 2021 9:27 am

Hi. I’m pretty new here. I posted my story under Is he/she gay...I think that was the title. Long story short...I’m almost going on 19 years married to my best friend from highschool. We started dating after highschool and things progressed fast. I was pregnant at 20, he was only 19. We were MADLY in love though...very passionate, everyone’s fairytale couple. Till this day, people comment on our love for eachother, aspire to be like us. If they only knew the truth though. I married my husband fully aware that he was bisexual. His attraction to men, according to him, faded though and he had no desires to explore that side of himself as he was very much into me and what we had going on.

Fast forward through our marriage and 3 kids later...I learn in 2009 that he and a woman co-worker were having some sort of affair. I had suspected it so was snooping on the computer and actually came across an email exchange between him and another male. Sexual in nature, with the attempt to hook up possibly. When I confronted my husband he said nothing came of it because when the guy shared his picture he was not interested. Then my husband opened up about this other woman and that was SUCH a bigger issue at the time that the man was forgotten about. A few days later, my best friend shared knowledge she had about my husband coming onto a fellow male classmate from school (my husband did a fast track degree program while we were married). He apparently had kissed and touched this gay friend while in the bathroom at their graduation party...I was literally just outside. When I confronted my husband he said he was drunk and it’s only when he’s drinking that he desires men.

So we get through this devastating blow. Things get really really good again. Very passionate, lots of time and talk and connection to eachother. Fast forward to 2017. Our sex life is dwindling, our connection bad. In June of 2017, we had our last attempt at intercourse as he is having repeated issues keeping an erection. He chalks it up to a bad connection between us. Legit in my mind because we weren’t getting along as well. As my suspicions grow, I begin snooping again. He had conveniently got a new phone but his old one was still in the house and connected to the iCloud. I find map searches for gay/drag bars, Craigslist searches etc.. all while he’s traveling. (Prior to Covid he traveled a lot). Confrontation time. This time, he admits it, says he loves me but is just curious and has desires, has never acted on them.

Present day, I’ve found more messages. I found a KY jelly receipt that he claims was for a gag gift at work. I’ve had a difficult week and I want answers. We are about to travel for his birthday though at the end of the week. Do I talk to him now, wait for a counselor. How much do I want to know right now? What’s a good way to start? Anyone have experience with this? I love him and want to get answers, even if I learn he’s gay. I’m looking specifically for advice on the best questions and environment to ask them in. Is it dangerous to try this on my own without a counselor? Any advice on specific questions, ways I should start to keep it peaceful and honest/open?

Last edited by Epiphany (January 10, 2021 10:31 am)

**Posted by SusanneH** January 10, 2021 11:45 am

I don’t know about you, but I asked every time I found something. Of course, I got lies: “I never had sex with any of those men!” For 16 months. Like you, once I found enough, he admitted to ONE man at first, then admitted to having sex with men our entire relationship after he realized I was serious about a polygraph.
I was totally devastated, and couldn’t imagine staying, however making a big decision to kick him out while my head was all over the place didn’t feel right.
So, back to asking him. It’s up to you. Nothing about any of this is written in stone. We all have different things going on that make our situations different from each other.
I guess main thing is to try to keep it as peaceful as you can so he’ll open up more.
Good luck.
((((HUGS))))

**Posted by Daryl** January 10, 2021 12:23 pm

There are so many red flags here, your questions are justified. I haven't had to go into this type of confrontation session myself but I can recall a few nuggets of wisdom from other members here. One is to not reveal what you know, as the deceitful spouse will only want to admit/explain what you already know about. For example - You did what any normal spouse should do - you asked an honest question about the KY. I'm not suggesting you shouldn't have asked but what if the question was more like "Tell me what's going on here?" .... pause .... "Why do I have this receipt?" ... pause .... "From <insert store name here>? etc.. (The pauses are where he either knows exactly what you are talking about or feigns ignorance to try to draw out exactly what you know.) It's not fair to have to be an investigator into your own relationship but leading questions like this may help you figure out if he's being truthful with you or spinning.

It's worth mentioning that the "I was just curious" line of defense is one of the easiest go-to answers for the knowingly in-denial and deceptive spouse. It also puts the focus on you - Why don't you believe me? Don't you trust me? The other "easy" answer to some of these questions is the "It was just a joke" and "maybe I was hacked." I'm not saying that "curiosity" isn't an honest answer, it just seems more likely to me to be abused as an answer. If you go there once, and never again, curiosity is a possibility. On the other hand, if you repeatedly continue to visit the same place, it's not curiosity, it's an interest.

I can't answer your question about the trip, ask now or wait. I don't think there's one right answer here as every situation is different. Generally, I'd advise to ask once you are prepared for the answers. Best case and worst case. Always have a plan B ready. Actions are more important than words.

Hope there's something here that is helpful. Whatever you decide, take good care of yourself.

**Posted by LostAtSea** January 10, 2021 12:36 pm

At first I didn't believe there was any infidelity or cheating. He told me he realized he couldn't hide the fact and needed to admit to himself he was trans after 45 years. He also said he was trans woman and now possible bi and dealing with his sexuality. I didn't understand how all of a sudden, not on hormones not yet a woman you are now wanting to be with men. I asked are you gay now? He said no. I wondered to myself why is he telling me he maybe bi now?

My advice for what it's worth is to have a peacefully approach and maybe he will open up. But I caution you that this is like a layer of onion. In my experience everyday is different. Everyday through casual conversation and him not really being forthcoming, I piece things together myself. Everyday I get lies and more lines.

On a hunch, I ask for the password to the secret Amazon account all the purchases were made. He deleted the purchase order history. I didn't think it could be recovered, but Amazon deletes NOTHING! I found more sex toys than he wanted to admit. Then asked for the secret paypay account it was all paid with since I never had access to it. Then he admitted to begin on dating websites just to look for "validation" from men to be desires in his female form. Then asked for the password to the email address connected to this sites. We are in two different cities now and as soon as he gave me the password to the email, I immediately locked him out and changed the password. He of course deleted all the history, but I was able to still see sites he was on and email address he emailed. He was connecting with men and on hookup and porn sites. He said he never hooked up with men, but then I logged into our cell phone account and see text messages and found disgusting images all day everyday for 2 weeks when I was out of town. I was not even working just text men all day. I went back through my phone and no wonder I wouldn't hear from him thought he was "busy" working. One of the men he was chatting with said he wanted to meet up on 12/9. He was going out of town and says he's not due back on 12/11. I was flying in on 12/12. He tells me he wasn't looking to hookup, but the text string tells me all I need to know. He ended up canceling his flight anyway b/c of the broke the news to me on 11/29 and I told him to not come to the city where I am at. Had he flown back, they for sure would be hooking up before my flight came in. I am disgusted looking these images and can't get them out of my head!

A long relationship and matters of the heart hurt so bad. I didn't think with my brain for the last month because my heart has been racing non stop. I only discovered all the rest of his twisted lies last week. Here I was thinking he was all confused in the world not know who he is and trying to search for his soul. I felt sorry for him and helped him this past month even after he shattered my life. He almost had me fooled! Fool me once shame on you, Fool me twice shame on me.

A friend told me, if you start asking and starting looking......be prepared for what you might find or see. You maybe going down a deep deep rabbit hole. Lies are covered with my lies or just half truth. He believes not being forthcoming is not lying. I said I know you are stupid so please give me more respect than this stupid response.

Only YOU know what is best for you. Please listen to your intuition when making decisions. It's powerful and shouldn't be ignored.

Best of Luck and Stay strong!

**Posted by Daryl** January 10, 2021 12:51 pm

"not being forthcoming is not lying"

Indeed - that one appears often in so many stories here. "I didn't lie, I just didn't tell you the entire truth."

**Posted by Ellexoh_nz** January 10, 2021 1:38 pm

In the end it was quite clear that this reserved man I had lived with, loved, thought I knew .. actually saw his life separate to mine. Which gave him (in his mind) the entitlement to do what he wanted. He said to me once "I'm a 50 yr old man...I should be able to do what I like"
The months between October 2016 and February 2017 were the months he made so many obvious 'bad moves', told so many obvious lies, thinking I would never question him that I kept my own counsel and let the glaring "hey this is not right"s stack up till I had a pile of them and still wasn't sure what I felt was happening.. was actually happening. Until the email that said he wanted to explore that side of him. And to give him his due I suppose I should thank him for that bit of signed proof ( that I have copied, twice, and safely tucked away)

I wish now I hadn't been so emotional whenever I brought up the subject of losing him. No usually-reserved man likes a confronting/sobbing woman in his face but I thought for a while that surely he would realize what he'd be losing. Well, not for ages but when it came down to a choice between losing me (the woman in the bisexual closet with him) or possibly, and I'm only surmising because he won't talk about it .. having his cover blown because he's afraid the truth will come out.... He agreed to keeping those desires tamped down, thinking this would keep me happy. But it didn't. Those months where his demeanor changed so drastically towards me actually caused me to fall out of love with the man I thought I'd love forever

He still thinks we're 'okay' because he doesn't see his world should change much if it appears I'm happy. What's sad is... He puts no importance on what we've lost... because his world is fine

Elle

**Posted by inkundermyskin** January 10, 2021 3:33 pm

epiphany-i believe its our brains job to protect the heart. like other poster said, listen to that voice in your head. the voice of reason. ill repeat this as well- omission is lying as much as vocalizing it. finally, please please, if your heart isn't ready to see or hear more, i think you know enough already, don't continue to ask or investigate. maybe get in a bit of a better place in you mind. otherwise what you could find out will continue to beat up your heart.
elle- your words, strength, and brain astounds me. all you know, but you don't seem to defend him at all, and know your ultimate goal. thats awesome. your last line rings so true for me.
i moved out in march. i took my guitar, and my clothes. that's it. 47 years old and starting from scratch in everyway. i thought that by leaving everything, it would be good for her girls. i didn't want to strip them of the world they knew. however in doing so, my ex kept her world as well. i even gave her money for 6 months to help out. so her world probably seemed fine. fuck.