Offline
Have others found there gay spouse/ex to have been highly skilled at manipulation and gaslighting?
I'm just realizing the depth of my stbgxh's. I think when I witnessed him doing it to the kids that I was like ohhh.... it is him... I'm not crazy and remembering things wrong.
My stbx has always been good at talking out of both sides of his mouth. I would compare it to something like if I were to say the sky is blue and he would argue with me that it's actually red...it would prob sound something like this:
It's actually not blue, it's actually red. You're right but you're wrong. We'll it is blue. But it's not blue, it's red. But I can see how you think it's blue, but you're wrong, it's red. I mean it is blue but it's actually NOT, it's red.
I'm not sure if that's a great example or the circular talk he does. But he would just mind f&ck me constantly. Or say he never said what he said moments ago or the day before.
He's gone back and forth on I never loved you I never wanted to marry you (then WHY did you?) to I still love you very much (then why do you keep hurting me and trying to leave me with nothing?)
It's never ending. I'm trying to get him to agree to a dissolution and leave soon but he's being difficult. I've agreed no spousal support, no child support, no help towards medical, all in exchange for him to let me have the house (still has 16 years left of 1st mortgage plus a second mortgage that I will be assuming). And he's still in a idk... why don't you give ME the house if you weren't after the house all these years? Bc the house is affordable and I can't afford another house and YOU took 25 years of my life the LEAST you can do is let me take over the house. It's not like it's free and clear I have to continue paying on it.
I know he is trying to manipulate me into "proving" I wasn't after him for his money (he was only making like $12/hr when we got married... clearly I was not gold digging) or the house (we both purchased the house together and my parents loaned me money for the down payment). Making accusations like this always paid off for him in the past with me working my ass off to "prove" him wrong. I chose a foreclosed house years ago to keep expenses down. So that we could focus on the kids and building a life together and not down in debt. There is a good amount of equity right now due to the market being inflated- but that could change to where there isn't any equity if the market crashes. And I don't want to sell the house I want to keep it for me and my kids so my daughter can stay throughout college and if they ever need to come back home they have a place to come home to. If I have to move somewhere more expensive I can't help my kids, and their dad def isn't helping them. He's already told our (minor) daughter that she has a job so he shouldn't have to pay child support, she should be able to take care of herself. I know he isn't going to help her pay for college after high school.
I guess I'm venting and looking for confirmation from others that I'm not alone in being completely gaslit and manipulated over the years. That I'm not a completely stupid, totally gullible person.
Offline
You are not alone. You don't have to browse many of our stories to fine similar examples of double-speak or flat denials of obvious facts. And I think you made him a more than fair offer. If he's trying to talk you into something less for you, and better for him, I'd say no dice. My counter-offer would be to see what a Court feels is fair. Ultimately, you have to decide how best to handle this, but it does seem that your eyes are wide open. Vent away. I'm sure it's exhausting to keep pushing back on the BS. That can be part of the goal, to get you so tired you either believe it, or stop fighting.
Offline
oh man, you are describing the gaslighting so well it triggered me! Your stbx sounds like he came from the exact same cookie cutter as my ex.
Look don't expect things to get better, expect it to get worse. It took me 18 months to get the financial separation signed off. My solicitor said to me at one point you do realise he is emotionally abusing you don't you? well actually I hadn't even heard the term before. He is financially abusing you too, she added.
The relentless pressure to help himself to more than his fair share of everything went on and on right to the last moment, including hiding stuff at a friends house, and secreting money in a private bank account I knew nothing about. The gaslighting was equally intense, he still takes any opportunity that presents itself, ie if he meets up with someone I know. He has been very successful at gaslighting me to other people, like all wolves in sheep's clothing, he sounds so trustworthy and likeable.
The attitude of your stbx towards his daughter is so unkind to her. I feel for you.
Like most young people I was easily tricked, gets better when we get a bit older doesn't it but tbh, there's always a new con round the corner and I think I am innately naive but not gullible any more, doing well so far. I am not stupid and neither are you - the way you write makes me think you are intelligent not stupid!
When we got together in my mind my ex and I had formed a partnership. Now I can see that it wasn't the same for him, he bought a resource. I committed to his welfare. He had an attack of cupboard love. I trusted him and he played me, right from the beginning, continuing for as long as he could.
Offline
Thank you for sharing your similar story. It's so emotionally draining. I was also very young, 18, when I started dating him. I honestly loved him so much and it's so hard to think I was so easily manipulated. It's hard to fully trust anyone else.
I'm so sorry you have also gone through all of this as well. It's an emotional role coaster. I really hope we can get the divorce done soon and I can start the healing process and rebuilding my life. Hugs to all of you going through the same. 💜 Reading posts on this forum has truly been a life line for me.