Hello Vicky & Shaun,
Thank you for insight.  After I posted my question I went searching and done plenty of reading.
He is definitely Gaslighting.  The funny part of it....I am a strong woman that does not internalize the crap he spews, I know who I am and who I am not, to which I have stated to him "I know who I am, and what I am not, I do not need you, my parents, my kids, siblings or anyone to tell me (other than him the others have not, was making a point) and the only person that could tell me something different that I would actually listen to was the Good Lord above!  My faith is what gives me the strength, vision, backbone and fortitude to go forward.  I have a voice and use it quite often as I am not fearful to do so.
Gaslighting was definitely a new term for me, it gave me more insight to what I already new, just didn't have a name for it lol.  I was actually starting to wonder if he was on drugs and point blank asked.  The sad thing is I could say I'm guilty of Gaslighting also in the middle of our heated arguments telling him he's crazy because of the junk he keeps spewing.
I've been trying to get him to open up for a while to no avail, he keeps hiding whatever it is in this dark place he is in.
This woman did not have an exit plan, didn't  need one.  The day after Thanksgiving we we to the city on business, he had been having one of his fits before we left.  When we got to our destination in front of our business associate, he continued his fit, told me I had no place there to get the F out there, go F ing home, I was nothing but a sack of shit.  I tried to get him to calm down, and discuss with him and the business associate about separating the business, I wanted out.  The business associate backed him up and told me I didn't have a F ing thing to do with it, that I didn't sign the contract because I refused to.  Which was a blatant lie, they drew up the contract without me on it.  At the time I figured it was no big deal.  Everything else about the business is in both of our names.  Regardless I seen the handwriting  on the wall and left.  I send text to my guy often because I can actually say what needs to be said and he can read it and can't  cut me off.  I sent him a text and explained a few things, bottom line told him he needed to make living arrangements accordingly.
This is something I have tried to tell him for sometime, that I wanted out of the business.  He said I was only going to hurt myself.
He says that because of the money my mother and I have invested.  The money is pennies to some, but $6000.00 is everything my mother and I had combined.  I tried to stick it out because of my mother, because she has property taxes to pay before the end of December, but after Friday and his public display in front of the business associate I knew that was not possible.  Because I had "my own business" I am jobless.  Because I'm of the older generation it's harder to find employment (been through that before).  Color me crazy for not having an "exit plan", but I haven't seen him or talked to him since Friday.  My concern at this point is employment and getting my mother her money.
My opinion on regrets...do I regret loving him, no.  I've said this is something new with him, I've never seen in 20 years.  I will cherish our years together.  He is a human being that is hurting in this dark hole he is in, No matter what it might be or whether I understand or agree with it, I can't help him.  I have told him the that, that him and the Good Lord above are the only ones who can.
I am worn out with all of it and why I came here.
The things I feel like I was seeing that made me question his sexuality was the biggest thing for me to get insight to.  I am a believer "things aren't always as they seem"  and that goes both ways.  I surely would not want to make an bi/gay accusation or question to a straight man.
Again, sorry I'm so windy

P.S. I no sooner made my post, he showed up unannounced.  Same old stuff, the new:
1. I told him with his rantings keep Gaslighting me its not going to work.  He said I dont know what that means.  I told him I didn't either, but I do now and that has what you have been doing to me.(I'm sure he'll look it up, maybe a chance it will help him...who knows)
2. Post It Note on my desk with Straight Spouse Network & phone number( pretty sure he seen it)
3. Tried about 5 different things for sympathy...he didn't get it.

Last edited by LC (December 8, 2016 12:36 pm)

Vicky recently posted something that I'm reposting here. It's an excellent example of a straight spouse working to gain freedom from her manipulative and narcissistic gay husband. Well done Vicky!

1. So I had my counselling appointment yesterday.  I told him I was going as I was heading out the door and he was shocked.  I admit I was a bit chicken shit in waiting until the last minute.  At the counsellor I described to her what was happening and afterwards she pulls out this 'wheel' of abusive behaviours [called the "Power and Control Wheel"] and it was verbatim what I had just said minus any of the physically abusive behaviours and minus the financial control he's never done that either.  It was sort of weird to see it there like that on paper and have it validated by a professional.  When I literally just described to her those behaviours I can't really argue that he's not controlling/manipulative.  So there you have it.

​Vicky was so courageous to get counseling, even while fearing her gay husband's reaction. Not too long ago, she was describing her husband as a "good guy...and not really a narcissist at all."

​2. When I got home I told him why I was upset with him minus discussing the gay thing, we do not speak of that, and anyway his behaviour is reason enough to send me to a therapist.  What did he do...defend his actions!  Nothing, didn't take me up on my offer to go with me to the counsellor, nor did he agree to see one when I asked.  He didn't apologize, he barely said anything.  I don't know what I expected really I think he just wants to sweep it under the rug as per usual.  None of this is news to him, we've discussed these behaviours many times I just hadn't connected the dots that is was controlling behaviour and that really pisses me off.

​This is classic "gay in denial narcissist" behaviour. How do I know? Because I did the exact same things. An inability to accept blame, defending inexcusable behaviour, and certain "no go" zones like fear of discussing his homosexuality.

3. He's never happy or satisfied with what is a pretty good life, healthy children, good house, good car, good financial state, so I asked him about that, I asked him to really think about it and don't answer me but do I make him happy.  I am the one thing constantly in his life and he's never been happy, he changes jobs, friends, we moved, whatever it is we do it and is not satisfied.  So is it me he's not happy with? 

Although I'm not a mental health professional, this sounds like a form of depression. The gay in denial spouse is unhappy with himself and there is nothing the straight spouse can do to change that. While no one likes to hear themselves described as either a narcissist or co-dependent, what Vicky has written about is the way co-dependents think...or are trained to think by manipulative partners. The co-dependent is constantly giving more to fix a broken relationship. The narcissist simply takes and demands more. More concessions, more apologies, more money, more attention. But it will never be enough unfortunately.   

​4. Funny the gay thing wasn't enough, I thought we could work on THAT?  What was wrong with me?  But this I don't think it's possible.  I really think the outcome would have been different if he had been forthcoming and honest with me.  I tried so hard, he did not.  So that time has passed and I am over feeling sorry for him and driving my self mad from exhaustion, it's not fair to me. 

Well done Vicky! You're doing exactly what you should be doing and by that I mean protecting yourself. This is a huge step and you've made it so far in such a short period of time.

​5. We're hardly speaking to one another so it's a bit awkward.  The fact that I have work to do gives me an excuse to be tucked away in the basement working late to avoid speaking to him.  I don't really know what to do next.  Like I said he is actively working on his own business so it will be months before he has any significant income at all.  Likely longer that that before he can support himself.  I cannot kick him out, it was half my idea to come up here to the country to make a go of freeing ourselves from our office jobs.  I might just transition myself to the spare bedroom for now.  What I am afraid of is that he won't care if I do, I think if that happens it will be very hurtful.

The silent treatment is another way narcissists manipulate their partners. It's another form of control because it forces their partners on the defensive. Why? Because they know you'll try to 'talk it out' yet again which gives them the win. You'll always lose arguing with the gay-in-denial narcissist because they've spent their entire lives manipulating people.

6. But basically from the ["Power and Control"] wheel: making her afraid by smashing her things (destroying her property) he only does this occasionally but it's usually out of the blue and unwarranted and overreacting to a silly thing. ​Making her think she's crazy. Making her feel guilty (he's a pro at that and does it regularly). Controlling what she does, who she sees and talks to, where she goes, limiting her outside involvement (he's scared a lot of my friends off usually and this had been a bone of contention for me for a long time, I broke up with him over this but then discovered I was pregnant). Making light of the abuse and not taking her concerns about it seriously, saying it didn't happen. ​There were more things on the wheel but these are what applied to me.  There are things not on the wheel that he does but it's basically a pattern of controlling my emotions and manipulating me by making me feel guilty.  It's shocking how long I've made excuses for this behaviour and normalized it, I'm shaking my head at myself.  It's like now I've realized it I can't believe it, shit like making me feel guilty if I do something nice for someone or go to a movie with them, he'll say 'I would've liked to go with you to that movie' or 'I would have liked if you had bought me that'  I am always balancing what I do with others so for example if I see a movie with someone I make sure to suggest we should have a date night the next day, or else he'll say something about how I enjoy being with other people and not him, and if I do something nice for someone I do something nice for him too so he won't complain to me that I don't think of doing those things for him (not true at all).  I'll need to run errands and he'll want all of us to go, ya me him and 2 small kids should go to the grocery store, the drycleaner, the hardware store, etc.  Oh great idea.  But he wants to 'spend time with me' he says.

This paragraph gave me chills, particularly the "making her afraid by smashing her things (destroying her property) he only does this occasionally but it's usually out of the blue and unwarranted and overreacting to a silly thing." I read Vicky's statement more like this: "He makes me afraid by smashing things. It's out of the blue and unwarranted." This type of violence is never justified, particularly in front of small children, because it's another form of control. Through violence, the GID narcissist spouse transmits the message that he is in control and that there are certain things he won't discuss...like the gay thing. [Vicky described in other posts that he refuses to discuss the gay thing.] The guilt she described is also quite common I believe or at least it was in my relationship. Narcissists don't care about the people in their lives. What they care about is maintaining a steady supply of attention and adoration. So when their partners do things without them, they get extremely jealous, hurt, or possessive. They constantly make their partners feel guilty because they need ever increasing amounts of 'supply.'  

7. This past year I had already been realizing how I am always sacrificing my time, my appearance - no time for a haircut or clothing shopping because I don't want him pissed I was gone too long.  I often tried to squeeze these things in on my lunch break, I literally would dread walking in the house because I didn't know if he was going to be angry with me for being gone.  So this all sort of fell into place.  I had been starting to push back lately and he had been backing down, but how stupid was I that I just never noticed how bad it had gotten.  Maybe the push back I was giving him was the reason he's been over reacting to silly things lately, getting overly mad at the dumbest things.  Sorry for the rant, I am just stunned, it's cathartic to write it down and I'm just so mad at myself.  My blame in this is that I turned a blind eye to how bad it was with family and friends, we would argue about it and I would 'put my foot down' and threaten to leave but then I never did it.  I wonder what I should do about that, apologize to them, say something to them like that I realize it was a mistake that I'm sorry they had to put up with it? I honestly think the counsellor thinks I should leave him, she didn't say that at all but she said 'I won't tell you whether you should stay or go' that it would be up to me to decide that. 

Vicky has come a very long way in a short period of time. Imagine where she'll be six months from now? Not too long ago, she wrote that her husband was, "...a good guy...and not really a narcissist at all​." She's starting to set boundaries, reconnect with friends and family, and is getting professional help. The narcissist spends years grooming a partner and they isolate their partners and families because they don't want any competition. Vicky sounds like a strong-willed woman, but even the most assertive among us would crack under the constant pressure of living with a gay-in-denial narcissist. My ex-wife only started to heal once she'd gotten away from me and my many manipulations. Thank you for sharing Vicky. I always learn a lot from your brave posts.

Last edited by Séan (November 30, 2016 1:48 am)

Hello Vicky,
HANG IN THERE!  Second thoughts are normal.  I feel for you having small children in the middle of all this.  Mine are grown have no clue what my decisions would be if they were still small.  I encourage you to forget yesterday it's done and gone, and take it a day at a time.  As Sean said it sounds like you have already come a long way.
Hugs
LC

Three thoughts:
  Counseling with preconditions forbidding discussion of the very thing that you're going to counseling about? What is the point?
  Your doubts, your insecurity, your guilt all play into his hands.  He needs you to feel these things so that he can hope to hang on to the possibility that things can stay as they are--with you as cover.  
  Hang on to your realization about what he says and doesn't say--that he never considers life without you, only that you come as a package with the kids.  
   I hope the counseling appointment tells you more of what you need to know.  Good luck.
 

Thanks for sharing Kel and OOHC. Yes it's absurd that Vicky's husband refuses to discuss the gay thing in therapy, but gay or straight we've all been there. This is simply the denial phase of the gay spouse's sexuality. I think we should acknowledge that we're all at different points in our journeys. Given what I've read here, we all go through the same stages more or less of depression, denial, anger, acceptance etc. While some of us are living years after disclosure/divorce and have the advantage of hindsight, let's keep in mind that up until a month ago Vicky thought everything was just dandy with her marriage. (She's come a long way from watching in horror as her husband got a lap dance from a male stripper for example.) Vicky is moving much faster and more assertively than I ever did. Do I think they should discuss the gay thing in therapy? Yes, absolutely. But I also acknowledge the inhuman effort it probably took to get her narc-gay-in-denial husband to agree to therapy in the first place. She also seems committed to continuing therapy on her own, separately from her husband, whereas most of us tried couples therapy which was a complete sh*t show. Those of us further along might scream, "Hurry up!" but we should be mindful this is a slow process and it took us a lot of time and effort to work through our broken relationships. I hope I haven't offended anyone. Thanks again for sharing.