I apologize if I've in any way misunderstood your situation. There is the very real possibility that your son remains at home because he wants to protect you. If your husband is abusive and/or mentally ill, no son would want to "abandon" his mother. Perhaps you should discuss this with your son and then set a timeline for how you plan to exit the marriage. I reckon you should all focus on the real issues here - your husband and broken marriage - and work to resolve that situation. After all, it makes little sense to change your car's tires (namely getting your son to open up) when the motor (dad/husband) is broken. Please keep posting my friend. Be well!  

Thank you for posting SadMom. In reply: 

1. One clarification, [my son's wife who came out as a lesbian] suffered physical abuse (her bio father abused her mom and her brothers as well) and eventually homelessness when her mom finally left to get away from the domestic violence.

That's tragic. 

2. My understanding is no sexual abuse occurred from her father, although she was assaulted as a teenager by another teenager at a summer camp once. 

Another teen girl I assume? M'yeah I'm still calling bullsh*t on the entire "I was assaulted by a gay person and that's why I'm now gay so please treat me like a victim" narrative. As I have posted time and time again, sexual assault and child abuse are barbaric and rightfully illegal. HOWEVER, I think we have the right to be skeptical when such claims are made by people who have: 1. lied about their homosexuality their entire lives; 2. feel such overwhelming shame about being gay that they'd say or do anything to explain it away. This may or may not apply to your son's lesbian wife. Your choice. 

But allow me to explain. With regards to the common gay-in-denial husband's claims of "I was attacked by a gay guy in college so of course I love dildos and ass play now" again, I'm calling bullsh*t. I reckon most of these stories boil down to consensual first-time same-sex play after which the closeted person totally panicked. So when he claims, "I was attacked by a gay guy in a park back in college." the reality turns out to be "I drove to a gay cruising park back in college, nervously waited around for hours, made furtive eye contact with a hot guy my age, then followed him into the bushes, sucked him off, and then bolted because I was so scared." Most of the sexual assault claims I've read about here are along the lines of: closeted man was looking for sex; closeted man wanted to have sex with another man; closeted man went to a gay sex place; and then post-sexual encounter created an elaborate sexual assault narrative to make himself sound like a (straight) victim rather than enthusiastic participant. End of rant!  

2. I don't believe she is blaming her sexuality on abuse, but rather blaming the fact that she suppressed it so long because she was raised Mormon, and they have extremely homophobic views. 

Ok. But she brought it up, you didn't. Moreover, you're posting about it here, so I reckon she's making assault part of her coming out narrative. There are two possibilities here: either she's a good and honest person telling the truth; or she's lying to continue manipulating your son, you (his mom), and your family. 

3. Her other mental health problems, anxiety, depression and " zoning out" involuntarily are what she blames the abuse for. I know I sound like I'm defending her, and I guess I am, because I see her as kind of an innocent.

Wow she's the whole package isn't she? Look, I think you're a kind person for wanting to help her. HOWEVER, your son is the priority and I reckon you're now trying to tread water with a brick in each hand my friend. Your son dated/married a closeted lesbian. She is not physically attracted to your son and never will be. Your son is getting nothing out of continued contact with this emotionally damaged person. So you need to help your son detach, separate, divorce, end contact, and move on. Nothing positive will come out of continued contact with this troubled woman. 

4. She and my son met when she was 19 and he was 20. They were in college together, had a normal dating relationship except for her other mental health issues, which made a lot of things difficult for both of them.

I think what you're saying is, "This was a really f*cked up relationship from the start because she was a closeted lesbian Mormon."  

5. She was a virgin. She still hasn't been with a woman...

Correction: other than that time in summer camp with another (female) camper...and the lesbian porn...and that time in college with her friend...

6. ...but apparently is no longer attracted to men. 

Correction: she was never attracted to men because that's what being a lesbian is about. 

7. It's such a complicated story.

I'll say! 

8. On some level, I wonder if she is confused, and maybe she is just not attracted to anyone sexually right now because she has been in therapy about the abuse. Is it possible she is young, inexperienced and confused and she could become bisexual again?

There it is! You're hoping therapy will make her attracted to your son. So that's why you're posting here. Sadly, it's not going to happen my friend. When we're gay, we're just gay and there is no going back. Moreover, she was never "bisexual" to start with. She was born gay but pretended to be straight. That's the root of the problem.  

9. One of my good friends is a lesbian who left her marriage to a man after 25 years, and she tells me that she thinks my daughter in law is way too young to be so definitive right now.

Yes but I'll bet your lesbian friend didn't come out her first year of marriage.  Different circumstances. So your son and this self-proclaimed lesbian should stay married and then divorce in say 25 years after they've had a few kids? That appears to be what you're advocating. Look I know I'm being snarky with my responses but I'm trying to jar you out of your denial. While your son is suffering at the moment, she's actually done him a favour. Don't let your son stay married to this woman!   

10. She said she (my friend) struggled with her sexuality for 16 years before she was sure. Thoughts?

I reckon your friend is like me: she probably knew she was gay around age 5/6, hid it because those were different times, and came out years later when being gay was more socially acceptable. Forgive me but it doesn't sound like your daughter-in-law is struggling at all with her sexuality BECAUSE SHE JUST ANNOUNCED "I'M A LESBIAN" TO YOUR SON. Put bluntly, there is no stuffing the lesbian genie back in the bottle my friend. Time to detach, divorce, and move on. 

I second your advice SadMom: "I'd like to see him move out, get a divorce and rip the bandaid off so to speak." Amen to that! 

Last edited by Sean (November 16, 2020 11:24 am)

Sean, thanks for the tough love.

One correction, the assault was by a male and she hasn't been with a woman. I don't believe she is a liar, because she told my son these things before she came out. However, indeed, I'm grasping at straws trying to figure out how to navigate all of this.. My son loves her, wants her to be "family", and I am struggling hard with my negative feelings towards her, knowing how much pain she is putting him through. He is absolutely my first priority. He wants us all to be loving and accepting towards her. I'm angry and feel a lot of betrayal, because she betrayed our whole family, whether she intended to or not. But, right now, it seems he wants us to love and include her as part of the family still. I'm afraid if I push him to run and file for divorce, at the moment, he will cling to her before he will lean on me to help him get out. Does that make sense? I don't want to alienate him by alienating her, because I'm afraid he will just feel like his family is the enemy. He doesn't like to talk about it, and we haven't for several weeks now. We talk about once a week, but its about general things, or about how he's doing with the new meds, etc. I only ask about his own well being, not his relationship. But inside, I'm stewing and heartbroken for him, angry at her and sad for my whole family. So I'm trying, I guess, to justify putting forth the effort to be loving and accepting to her for his sake. He knows, and I know, this is temporary, and they will separate. And honestly, if she did say she discovered she is now bisexual again, I wouldn't want him to trust her anyway on that, after what he's been through. I don't think he's even hoping for that. It's all so difficult and confusing, and I do wish they would go their separate ways right now, but it's not happening, and we somehow have to cope as a family. I'm thinking after the holidays, I'll begin to push him a little. They will be here next week, together for thanksgiving, for a few days. The last time they were here, it was awkward, no one mentioned the elephant in the room, and I cried in the shower so they wouldn't see how upset I was. They act like a married couple still, slept in the same room they always have, together. And the rest of us (myself, my husband and my older son) have to try to pretend there is nothing wrong. It's sad and exhausting. My husband hates talking about it, my other son feels the same as I do. If we are going to be there to support him, we have to follow his lead, and right now, it's about including her and treating her the same. Ugh. Anyway, thank's for listening. I do appreciate the splash of cold water to the face. Hopefully, next year will be better, and he will be able to move away and start over. 

Hello again SadMom. In reply: 

1. Sean, thanks for the tough love.

I hope I didn't go overboard. 

2. One correction, the assault was by a male and she hasn't been with a woman. I don't believe she is a liar, because she told my son these things before she came out. However, indeed, I'm grasping at straws trying to figure out how to navigate all of this.

Fair enough. 

3. My son loves her, wants her to be "family", and I am struggling hard with my negative feelings towards her, knowing how much pain she is putting him through.

I can only imagine. 

4. He is absolutely my first priority. He wants us all to be loving and accepting towards her. I'm angry and feel a lot of betrayal, because she betrayed our whole family, whether she intended to or not. But, right now, it seems he wants us to love and include her as part of the family still.

Got it. 

5. I'm afraid if I push him to run and file for divorce, at the moment, he will cling to her before he will lean on me to help him get out. Does that make sense? I don't want to alienate him by alienating her, because I'm afraid he will just feel like his family is the enemy. He doesn't like to talk about it, and we haven't for several weeks now. We talk about once a week, but its about general things, or about how he's doing with the new meds, etc. I only ask about his own well being, not his relationship.

You seem to be between a rock and a hard place my friend. Perhaps you can just tell your son that it's a struggle NOT to discuss the elephant in the room, while also asking your son how he'd like you to support him going forward. You can also tell him that you can't continue pretending nothing has happened indefinitely. As always, I'd urge you to discuss this with your husband, family, and perhaps your therapist. 

6. But inside, I'm stewing and heartbroken for him, angry at her and sad for my whole family. So I'm trying, I guess, to justify putting forth the effort to be loving and accepting to her for his sake. He knows, and I know, this is temporary, and they will separate.

I agree and reckon it's just a matter of time before they separate/divorce. Homosexuality is less taboo these days so they'll hopefully feel less pressure to stay together now that your daughter-in-law has come out. 

7. And honestly, if she did say she discovered she is now bisexual again, I wouldn't want him to trust her anyway on that, after what he's been through. I don't think he's even hoping for that.

Well perhaps you can start by setting your own boundaries, namely that you won't be supportive of their relationship if they reconcile and decide to have children. It's not unusual for the gay-in-denial spouse to try to go back in the closet and quite often troubled couples will try the "big change" (a move, new jobs, or a baby) to revive a relationship. 

8. It's all so difficult and confusing, and I do wish they would go their separate ways right now, but it's not happening, and we somehow have to cope as a family. I'm thinking after the holidays, I'll begin to push him a little.

Rather than pushing, perhaps you can start by focusing on your self. And that means: setting your own boundaries; pledging unconditional support for ___ months; get his permission to discuss "the gay thing" starting on _____ 2021; and no emotional/financial support should they decide to reconcile and/or have kids because you would be against it. 

9. They will be here next week, together for thanksgiving, for a few days. The last time they were here, it was awkward, no one mentioned the elephant in the room, and I cried in the shower so they wouldn't see how upset I was.

I think you're fully justified in telling your son exactly that..."I'm crying in the shower while you're here." 

10. They act like a married couple still, slept in the same room they always have, together. And the rest of us (myself, my husband and my older son) have to try to pretend there is nothing wrong. It's sad and exhausting. My husband hates talking about it, my other son feels the same as I do. If we are going to be there to support him, we have to follow his lead, and right now, it's about including her and treating her the same.

This takes me back to my last uncomfortable family vacation as a straight couple. I was out and my family and friends had to pretend everything was ok when I'm sure they just wanted to shake me and scream "Wake the f*ck up!" 

11. Ugh. Anyway, thank's for listening. I do appreciate the splash of cold water to the face. Hopefully, next year will be better, and he will be able to move away and start over.

I'm so sorry you're all suffering. I do however believe you are fully justified in sharing the facts. Using "I" sentences doesn't create conflict because you're not attacking your son nor his (soon-to-be) ex-wife. You could say things like: not talking about this is killing me because I want to support you; your father and I are no longer sleeping; we can't continue pretending nothing has changed etc. 

As you've stated, I reckon time is on your side. Your son can't keep treading (emotional) water forever...with his lesbian wife standing on his shoulders. Good luck with Thanksgiving and please keep posting.

Last edited by Séan (November 16, 2020 2:42 pm)

TangledOil wrote:

Julian, 

I’m curious. Did your husband tell you why he decided to tell you? I’d guess there had to be a reason. 

Tangled 

I struggled with this a lot...because why would he throw a bomb into the marriage unless he wanted me to *do* something with that information? I'm not sure I'll ever really know the answer. As I mentioned earlier, there weren't any typical red flags. I was in complete shock. He was in a pretty depressed state for several weeks before "the big reveal" (on his birthday of all days)...but I thought it was just because of work stress. 

I did not take the news well because I felt deceived...lied to...And, honestly, at the time I thought this marriage is over. I got us into marriage counseling soon after because I wanted to make things as painless as possible for our (at the time) 3-year-old daughter. He is truly a great dad—and our daughter is naturally my #1 priority—so no matter what happened with the marriage, I wanted to make sure we could move on amicably.

He was actually pretty cold during this time: emotionless and seemingly devoid of empathy for what I was feeling. ...In counseling, I felt like I was sitting on the couch with a pod person. It was an incredibly difficult time for me. I don't know how common this is.

Eventually, things just sort of calmed down...I felt like my life was becoming too consumed with his sexuality...and trying to untangle that confusion (on my own)...so I started exercising more, reading more, meditating more... I think this has really helped...and we're in a much better place now.

He did say (sometime early on) that he felt like a weight had lifted off of him...which is great...but, I sometimes feel like I carry that weight now. We don't talk about it anymore...which is probably unhealthy...but, honestly, I don't even know what to say. Once this COVID craziness is over, I'd like him to get into solo counseling if he's willing. If I could go back in time, I think that's what I would have done early on (solo counseling for both of us).