Letsbehonest,

That is abuse.  I lived 2 years in fear.  Be safe...practice detachment and no contact.  Tell him you will call the police if touches you again.  Then give him silence instead of talking about TGT.
You deserve a safe environment for you and the kids.

This is the most dangerous time - when you are telling them the truth and they realize that it means a life change is coming that they don't want.  What a normal, healthy person would do is get sad - because they're losing something they want.  But these narcissists don't GET sad - they get angry. Not at their situation, but at you.  Because to them, YOU are the problem.  If they could just change your mind and make you think and behave differently, then their world would be just as they want it.  And for a long time, he WAS able to do that - get what he wanted (even if it wasn't making you happy).  Making YOU happy was never important to him - getting what HE wanted was.  Now that that's in danger, he's pissed.  And a narcissist is very dangerous when pissed off - even if they don't really have a right to be angry in the first place because the limitations and changes are all due to their OWN desires.

Start figuring out an exit plan.  Stop talking about how you feel about his actions.  You now know that he's willing to lie to you, manipulate you and belittle you.  That means that you two aren't ever going to come to a place of compromise because he's expecting YOU to do all the compromising, and you're done with that.  You don't need to discuss it any longer - you know who he is and what he wants, and you're not planning on meeting those needs and wants.  He has the choice to tell you that he'll stop, or what he's willing to put on the table.  He's not doing that, so that means you two can't make this work.

The only time you need to have any discussion about it is when he's pressuring you to have sex, and you need to get clear beforehand on what type of encounter that will be. Because if you don't, he'll keep taking you down Butt Road, and he'll act like you MUST have known this was was on the table, because it's what's BEEN on the table, and unless you state otherwise, it's what's going to BE on the table.  If he tries that whole, "Why do we need to define what's going to happen?  Can't we just let it unfold?" bullshit, then you just tell him that you've been DOING that, and it's not working for you.  A man should be able to make a woman feel comfortable and safe about the sexual experience she's going into - it's paramount to being emotionally open, which is what sex is all about - vulnerability and connectivity.  And if you can't be assured that you'll be safe and comfortable with the upcoming experience, then you can't be vulnerable, and you refuse to have sex with your partner when it's not about intimacy and connectivity.  If intimacy and vulnerability is what's important to HIM, then he should be willing to do what it takes to get that - for you and for him.  If he's NOT willing to make concessions, then he's not about you and making you feel comfortable.  And I'm sorry - but a straight man in love is ALL.ABOUT making his woman happy - it's where HIS happiness stems from.

If you've decided you're done with him, then maybe you don't want to have sex with him anymore anyway.  The trick there is figuring out a way to stop having sex with him without letting him know that you're planning on exiting (until you're ready to do so).  THAT is challenging.  You could just tell him that you're not planning on having any encounters with him unless they're on YOUR terms.  You then run the risk though of him telling you that he'll do it your way, and then you feeling like you have no excuse to not have sex with him then.  It may be less of a worry than you think it'd be, though.  I've told certain people in my past that things need to happen on my terms, which is X (not necessarily sexual things), and I've often been surprised that they don't just throw a time or two of meeting my expectation out there - just to hook me again.  They literally CANNOT meet me on my terms - even a few times.  Which makes it all that much easier to make it look like the ball is in THEIR court, and they've just decided not to meet the required terms.  I told my ex that we couldn't have sex any more if he couldn't kiss me intimately.  I was really done with sex with him at that point anyway, but figured he WOULD try to give me a few pecks just to get what he wanted.  And he DIDN'T.  Never had sex with him again.  I told my son emotionally disturbed son that he couldn't come live back at home until he started counseling.  I told him I'd take him there and back, pay his deductible, the works.  I figured he'd go once or twice - then SAY he was going, and want to move back in.  Nope! Never went. Never even attempted to meet the parameters.  You'd be surprised how little they try to meet YOUR demands when you lay them out.  Try it - it's quite entertaining.

Kel

Oh.My.GOD.  These guys are just TOO MUCH!

This is just another control tactic.  He's figured out that he's been unable to get you to change your mind based upon the words that he's been saying up until now.  So he's changing tactics - hit her where it counts - the KIDS!  Brilliant!  Accuse her of being a bad mother.  Oh wait - that won't work, because she's doing all the right things - IN THE HOUSE. All the things that she's done all along that made her a good mom.  So.... I have to twist this to make it look like something she's doing OUTSIDE the house is making her look like a bad mom.  WORK! Yeah! Oh wait - she works teaching little kids.  Damn, that'll never work. But wait - all this is still kind of new. I'll accuse her of changing since she started working.  Yeah! I'll say that she's..... loving being out and away from the kids.  She's.... showing herself off!  I'll even NAME this little thing I've made up, to make it more real: Vanity Project.  YEAH!  Brilliant!  Now she'll need to defend herself by quitting work, so she doesn't look like a bad mom.  That'll tie her hands into not being able to leave - it'll be like making her move BACKWARDS. BRILLIANT! I'll make her feel like it looks to the outside world and the kids that she's a selfish, vain person - one who is being that way at the cost of her marriage - which will hurt the kids. She'll definitely start taking countermeasure to avoid being seen as a bad mother.  And then she'll be all wrapped up in her own behavior instead of mine.

(insert eye roll here)

I KNOW that being accused of being a bad mother is BIG.  I know it - my ex tried it on me, too.  He went and told my entire family that I was out every night of the week, away from the kids.  So that they'd all start pressuring me to stay home more (instead of running around to the pharmacy at 10 pm to pick up meds AFTER the kids had gone to sleep).  And it almost worked.  Until I made it clear to my family that they knew me, they knew who I was, I would never do that to my kids, I'm NOT doing that to my kids, and they were insulting me by believing this crap.  They likely still believed it - but they got off my back about it, because it wasn't working to confront me.

You need to grow a thick skin.  I know that's difficult - because up until about two weeks ago, you were responding to all his bullshit and doing things his way.  It's a huge change for you to be who you're being now, and it's not easy for you.  So coming up against resistance is going to be really difficult.  But once you know these words are just tactics to throw you off of his crap, they can start bouncing off a bit easier.  I'd be tempted to say, "Vanity Project? That's what you're telling yourself this is about? You need to watch men while having sex with your wife, but you're making this about me? Whatever you need to tell yourself, buddy. So this is me "Vanity Project-ing" out of your life."

He might keep on this mom thing even after you tell him off. That's when you get to the part where you start saying the same thing over and over again.  "This again? NOT WORKING." (walk away). All future mentions: eye roll, "Not working." walk away.

He will continue to change tactics to see if he can find one that works.  Next will come that you must have met someone at work who you're leaving him for.  You're a cheating slut.  Then it will be that you never loved him in the first place - you just wanted someone to support you so you could make babies. Then it'll be how pathetic you are, and that you'll never find anyone ever again.  You will need to have short responses to each one of these, followed by a mantra.  "I'll take my chances."  You don't need to be mean and biting, necessarily - but you can't roll over and show him your underbelly, either.  He's looking for that - so he can attack and get what he wants.

You could just come out and say, "Look, I just don't want this anymore. I'm not happy. You're not even attempting to make me happy. When I tell you how unhappy I am, instead of changing that thing, you just insult me and belittle me.  THAT's not gonna get you anywhere. You've done too much damage already - there's no coming back to a healthy place from here. Just call it and move on already. Find yourself someone who is happy with the way you want to do things. You make it seem like your preferences are completely normal, so it shouldn't be difficult to find someone if that's the truth. Go be happy, and let me do the same."

I find it very interesting that he's not just telling you that he'll stop the behaviors that disgust you, and started doing some of what you consider normal.  It would be SO.EASY to go that route and give you some false hope.  It's actually good that he's NOT going that route - because you can get stuck in that futile cycle forever because it gives you a bit of hope. That's what most GID men do - they will start kissing you on the mouth. They will put away the iPad. And they will expect that you'll be happy now, and they'll act like nothing was ever wrong in the first place.  Then they'll slide right back to where they were over the course of a year or so.  They would be love bombing.  If he's not even attempting to do those things, he doesn't even have it in him to pretend for your sake.  Which is VERY telling.

You're doing well.  You can do this.

Kel
 

Abby and Kel I thank you both

My children 12 and 14. You think wait till leave home or now divorce?  If I stay maybe I get depression knowing truth but tell no one.  How do I live 6 years more in a lie?

LetsB,

There is no hard and fast timeline to this.    You do what you need to do..taking small steps, coping, gathering strength.   You will know when its time...your body will tell you or your mind will see any unknown future better the present situation.      I knew it was time when my body was shaking with  trauma and my mind told me lefts pull over and sleep on side of the road tonight.

Gather strength....  observe, don't absorb the treatment. of you.

 

Last edited by Rob (March 22, 2018 10:13 pm)