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May 23, 2017 8:58 am  #1


Guilt Trip

So my husband decided we should talk this morning.  Just need to vent and hear the truth to offset the guilt he's laying on me.  Lets see if I can summarize this:

​1. "It feels like your just stopping in you tracks because you didn't like what she said" - Because I told him I hadn't planned on going to counseling tomorrow.
​2. "You said you needed to go alone?" ( No he told me that maybe I should go on my own. - which I told him)
​3. "You seem to be stuck on the gay porn??  I'm NOT sexually attracted to men.  I watched everything. When a good looking woman walks in the door I think wow she's pretty, I never think that about a man"
​4. "You keep bringing up the Craig's list ads.  That was 4 or so years ago.  It's like you think I acted on it."  
​     - I told him I didn't know if he had acted on it or not, but I don't believe that you look at those ads without at least the thought of acting on it.  "I have never considered nor will I ever cheat on you with a woman or a man"  Although he did admit masturbating to porn is the equivalent of cheating.
​5.  "Is it the anal sex?  Lot's of straight men like to have anal sex with their wives"
​6.  "Is it because I like oral?  Lot's of straight men like to receive oral sex from their wives"
​7.  " I understand that you had addressed this before but you never REALLY addressed it.  I knew it was a problem before you busted me, I just didn't know how to quit, but you helped give me the courage or urgency"
​8.    "I feel like now that I'm in the middle of my storm you are leaving me instead of supporting me"


​I think I did pretty well with all of this.  I told him that I believe he is sexually attracted to men, even if he doesn't want to be and that I don't feel like it's something that can be changed.   That he can chose to fight it but that doesn't make the desires go away or make him desire me.  He assures me that he does and always has desired me but he just didn't know how to show me....  ok???  Told him I was at the point that if this has to be my fault because I just can't get over it so be it.   I called out on the guilt trip statement about the storm and told him that me making the decision that I couldn't be his wife had nothing to do with me supporting him.  I have held him accountable and made him face it instead of just walking away from the beginning.  Sounds supportive to me.  

​I also told him I didn't think we were doing our kids any favors and he told me that we were showing our kids that when things get tough you work through it.  


​Yep it is all going to be on me...   my kids are too young for me to tell them that dad was looking at gay porn. 


 

 

May 23, 2017 10:16 am  #2


Re: Guilt Trip

Hi Bec,

His words are not unexpected.  He's acting exactly the way I expected him to.  I'm sure you're not very surprised, either.  You seem to know that he's full of it.  Lol.

I'm putting his words through the bullshit translator:

1.  "It feels like your just stopping in you tracks because you didn't like what she said"
This means that instead of accepting that you don't want to feel bullied again this week, he's going to try to make this about you being oversensitive - and only working on the marriage if it's on your terms.  Well,... gues what?  We ALL work on the marriage if it's on our terms.  If the counselor said, "In order to save your marriage, you need to stand on your head all week until the next appointment.", ANYone would be like, "Ummm, NO.  That's stupid.  And that's not going to happen."  HIS counselor (because for some reason, that's what she is) telling you that your husband's behavior is NOT indicative of him being gay is HER opinion.  You disagree with her.  This is fundamental to the argument of how to proceed.  Whether he's gay or not is paramount to how counseling and fixing or giving up on the marriage proceeds.  You have a fundamental difference here.  And since that's where you're at with this counselor, it makes no sense to proceed.

2.  "You said you needed to go alone?"  No, I never said that - YOU did.  Don't try to put it into my mind as if it was my thought and not yours.  What do you think I am, an idiot?  What Iiiii need is to go to someone who is objective, not just convinced that your actions in this relationship are not indicative of who you really are.

3.  "You seem to be stuck on the gay porn??  Ummm,.... YEAH I'm stuck on the gay porn!!!  It's not benign.  Combined with the CL ads, it's just more proof of what's going on in his mind.  If YOU were answering CL ads and looking at porn that matched that, it'd be indicative of you liking that thing.  DUH.  Again, he's asking you to believe lies because you can't "prove" that they're lies.  But 1 + 1 = 2.  If he never did either of the 1's, there'd BE no 2.  His fault.

4.  "You keep bringing up the Craig's list ads.  That was 4 or so years ago.  It's like you think I acted on it."
First off, tell me more about the ads.  Was there proof that he just perused the ads, or was he responding to them?  If the latter, then what was he saying?

5.  "Is it the anal sex?  Lot's of straight men like to have anal sex with their wives".  This is him trying to make it look like you have insignificant reasons for thinking there's a problem.  The anal sex - to you - ONLY when he's drunk - means that he's only showing you what he really wants when he's compromised.  And when you combine it with gay CL ads and gay porn, you start to see a picture here.  It's NOT the anal sex.  It's the anal sex in addition to all the other actions that start to tell you what he likes.

6.  "Is it because I like oral?  Lot's of straight men like to receive oral sex from their wives"  NO.  Oral isn't the problem.  The problem is that you respond to gay CL ads, you watch gay porn, you only want anal when you're compromised, AND you seem to prefer closing your eyes while getting oral to actually having vaginal sex with your wife.  It's a complete picture here.

7.  " I understand that you had addressed this before but you never REALLY addressed it.  I knew it was a problem before you busted me, I just didn't know how to quit, but you helped give me the courage or urgency"
I NEVER should have HAD this problem to address.  This is YOUR issue - you admit to knowing that even before I busted you.  But now it's MY fault that I didn't "truly" address the problem???  I didn't create "urgency" - I created panic - because you knew once I found out what you were doing, it was going to be a HUGE problem.  And STILL you didn't fix it?  The only thing creating urgency here is me finding out who you really are.

8.  "I feel like now that I'm in the middle of my storm you are leaving me instead of supporting me."  Well, feel whatever you want.  Iiiii feel like you've already abandoned me, and you want to somehow be the victim now.  And make ME the bad guy for not helping you in your time of need.  This isn't YOUR time of need - it's MINE.  This is akin to a rapist saying that he has a raping problem, and why won't his victim support him in overcoming his rapey ways?  It's complete bullshit.

Bottom line is that he's destroyed your trust, and he didn't stop his illicit behavior until you CAUGHT him.  Then it became a big deal - because he knew you'd react in a big way to his behavior.  He'd like to make you believe that he's stopped this behavior, so now there's no problem.  The problem is that the behavior existed in the FIRST place.  If he admits that he knew it was a problem before you found out, then what he's admitting is either a) It was SUCH a problem that he couldn't stop, or b) He could have stopped, but he didn't.  WHICH is worse?  If the explanation is a, then why should you think that he's able to stop his racing mind now?  If it's b, then why would he not stop problematic behavior until AFTER it hurt you?

You do not owe it to him to stick by him after he cheated on you.  You just.... DON'T.  And he's an asshole for implying so.  Proving that he's still being selfish.  He's NOT owning any of his behavior, or apologizing, or showing you through his transparency that he will never do such a thing again.  Just.... believe him.  Have faith in him.  Stand by him.  Well, that's what HE was supposed to be doing for YOU. And he didn't.

Kel


You are not required to set yourself on fire to keep other people warm.
 

May 23, 2017 11:16 am  #3


Re: Guilt Trip

I never found evidence that he responded to the ads, only that he looked at two separate occasions.   He says he was just curious.   

Told me today the gay porn was just curiosity as well.   I said maybe if you had watched 1 or 2, but not over and over again.  Over 2-3 years that I know of.

He claims he didn't know how to stop, but now has quit cold turkey.   Again, if this was just a porn addiction I would be willing but it's not just a porn addiction.  It's 13 years of no desire, minimal sex, and looking at gay porn, CL ads, and choosing to masturbate to men masturbating on periscope......   But he had no sexual desire for men.....    I simply don't understand his brain and I'm sure I never will.

     Thread Starter
 

May 23, 2017 11:55 am  #4


Re: Guilt Trip

On the contrary - I think you understand his brain very well.  He just won't admit anything that impairs his image.  Because he's scared of the fallout of that.  Always has been, otherwise he would have explored this much earlier in life and come to terms with it.  It's how our society was.  But he's throwing you under the bus because he can't handle the stress himself.

And this B.S. about "I found you attractive but just didn't know how to show it" - yeah, that's ridiculous.  My ex used to say something similar when I told him that he never complimented me - never made me feel seen.  I'd say, "Why can't you tell me when I'm all done up that I look nice?", and he'd say, "I don't know how to do that!"  The Fuq? You say, "YOU LOOK NICE".  This ain't rocket science.

Men don't need to think about or figure out how to show their desire toward women.  They may need to think on how to tone it DOWN a bit, so they don't scare the women or intimidate them.  So that's the OPPOSITE problem.  He is literally telling you that he didn't know how to show you desire when he started a relationship with you, MARRIED you, and had children with you - but didn't know how to show desire?  No, it's that he couldn't FEEL desire - because he likes men.  He just didn't know how to FAKE IT.

Kel

P.S. - St8 men NEVER go look at what other gay men want - out of curiosity.  They have plenty of other sexual urges to satisfy - they don't need to throw the ones in there that make them sick, too.

I swear - they must think we're freaking idiots to believe the lies they conjure up.  How dumb do you think I AM?!?!?

 


You are not required to set yourself on fire to keep other people warm.
 

May 23, 2017 12:30 pm  #5


Re: Guilt Trip

Deleted

Last edited by Duped (November 11, 2019 2:55 pm)

 

May 23, 2017 3:39 pm  #6


Re: Guilt Trip

It just amazes me how the stories always have so much in common. 

We also didn't have sex for months and it wasn't for lack of trying on my part. 
Never and I mean never had he complemented me or told me that I was beautiful.   The closest I ever got was that's a nice shirt.   

It stupid really when I sit back and look at it all.

     Thread Starter
 

May 23, 2017 4:20 pm  #7


Re: Guilt Trip

It's amazing the crumbs that we subsisted on for so long, isn't it? All because our expectations were made to seem unreasonable repeatedly, until next to nothing was the new normal.  The only way to not be continually disappointed in what we were getting was to expect so little that we'd never feel the discrepancy between what we expected and what we received.  Until one day, when we realize that these crumbs will not continue to sustain us moving forward.  We were starving to death on the crumbs we have to beg for. 

It's only when you get some distance from the situation that you can begin to realize how little sustenance you were existing on - just to be able to say you stayed together?!?  Just to be able to say that your commitment outweighed your personal needs.  Just to say that you weren't greedy.  It is only when you move away from starving to death that you realize you should NEVER have been expected to accept existing on so little.  And that you weren't greedy for asking for enough to stay alive.

Kel


You are not required to set yourself on fire to keep other people warm.
 

May 23, 2017 6:50 pm  #8


Re: Guilt Trip


  • Interesting Bible point of view: Notice how they 'act and continue this distructive course:

  • 2 Peter: 2 -But these men, like unreasoning animals that act on instinct and are born* to be caught and destroyed, speak abusively about things of which they are ignorant.+ They will suffer destruction brought on by their own destructive course, 13 suffering harm as their reward for their own harmful course.They consider it pleasurable to indulge in luxurious living,+ even in the daytime. They are spots and blemishes who revel* in their deceptive teachings while feasting together with you.+ 14 Their eyes are full of adultery+ and are unable to desist from sin, and they entice unstable ones.* They have a heart trained in greed. They are accursed children. 15 Abandoning the straight path, they have been led astray. ROMANS 1:1- That is why God gave them over to uncontrolled sexual passion,+ for their females changed the natural use of themselves into one contrary to nature;+27 likewise also the males left the natural use of* the female and became violently inflamed in their lust toward one another, males with males,+ working what is obscene and receiving in themselves the full penalty,* which was due for their error.+28 Just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God,* God gave them over to a disapproved mental state, to do the things not fitting.+ 29 And they were filled with all unrighteousness,+ wickedness, greed,*+ and badness, being full of envy,+ murder,+ strife, deceit,+ and malice,+ being whisperers,*30 backbiters,+ haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, schemers of what is harmful,* disobedient to parents,+ 31 without understanding,+ false to agreements, having no natural affection, and merciless. 32 Although these know full well the righteous decree of God—that those practicing such things are deserving of death+—they not only keep on doing them but also approve of those practicing them.

    So this has been going on and a patterrn of today. Thankfully we have someone watching it all and knows. These mentioned have chosen to not change and so it goes...
    There is a payback..but it may need to come from the Highest power. 
    YES!!!!

 

May 24, 2017 12:14 am  #9


Re: Guilt Trip

Awake,

There are no take backs with TGT..you can not say I don't like men after getting caught looking at them.   What if he goes out with a buddy for a beer..is it two guys having a beer or a date?  Why should you have to wonder.

Yes leave vengeance to God.  God knows what they did and revenge is his to dish out.


"For we walk by faith, not by sight .."  2Corinthians 5:7
 

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