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December 5, 2017 11:27 am  #1


I unwittingly married a transwoman

 

Last edited by transwondering (December 15, 2017 7:20 pm)

 

December 5, 2017 12:28 pm  #2


Re: I unwittingly married a transwoman

transwondering,
   I'm so sorry for what you've gone through, all of it: the selfishness of your partner's decision to marry you under false pretenses, the entitlement that lies behind that unilateral declaration that "I have to change," with its concomitant, equally entitled and narcissistic assumption (demand?) that of course you will in all things be following your partner's lead and leading the cheerleading squad, all the way down to those "allies" who are so supportive but have no effing clue of what exactly in the details it is they're so supportive of, while you, who have not only a front row seat but a part written for you, a script handed to you, and a director to tell you what is expected, are written off.  

 I understand.  I've been where you've been, trying so hard to stay, thinking about my spouse, trying to support my spouse even while watching him resort to misogynist porn caricatures of woman and gendering every damned thing in sight, thinking support was the only ethical path for me, squelching every doubt or discomfort I was feeling, and having every one of my doubts or hesitations met with outrage and anger.   What I realized, finally, is that although I was still operating as if I was part of a committed couple, my partner was acting only for himself and with only himself in mind.  "To the degree you can enjoy me as a woman we have a future together," he said, early on, although I was unable at the time to hear that as the ultimatum it was.  

   To combat the blame-shifting guilt trip of your partner's "what if I had a brain tumor" I suggest you flip the script.  When your partner asks whether you'd leave if s/he had a brain tumor, you can remind them that s/he was the one to change the terms of the marriage--you didn't leave or end the marriage, he did, by telling you he intended to become a she.  S/he's no longer the person you married--in the most fundamental of ways. The correct analogy is not "would you leave me if I had a brain tumor?" but "what if I decided I wanted a brain tumor?"  Plus, I would bet dollars to donuts that in other contexts your spouse would mightily contest the idea that s/he's ill or that transness is in any way an illness, mental, say, or even any other kind of disaster.  As you say, too, in other contexts the LBGT community insists that sexual orientation is immutable and inborn--so why is it we hetero spouses are treated as if we can simply declare ourselves lesbians to our transgendered partners?  If you ask me, this little bit of illogic is the sticking point that reveals that no one, not even the LBGT community, really believes transwomen are women, even if that is the battle cry.  (Why else do transwomen harass lesbians who won't consider them as sexual partners and try to bludgeon them--literally and verbally--into acquiescence?)

Vent away, sister.  I'm sure you've got six months of frustration bottled up in there.  You will find others on this forum, currently and in the past, who share your frustration and understand its source and the vexations you are living with. 
 

Last edited by OutofHisCloset (December 5, 2017 12:34 pm)

 

December 5, 2017 12:47 pm  #3


Re: I unwittingly married a transwoman

You are not a bad person. The relationship was redefined for you in such a way it was no longer what you had vowed to honour. It is unfair to expect someone to change their sexuality to accommodate another, this is a two-way street. As Kel says in her signature - you are not obligated to set yourself on fire to keep someone else warm.

The brain tumour question isn't a fair analogy. Even if it's terminal it does not fundamentally change the nature of your partner into a completely different person then the one you married.

I'm all for LGBTQ rights and happy for anyone who chooses to live their truth but I have less respect and support for someone who entangles another into a sham of a relationship until they work up the courage to be honest with themselves and the world. We are a side of the 'coming out' story few want to talk about, perhaps because they don't know what to say without feeling like they are gay-bashing. We have the right to live and speak our truth. Not everyone will understand.


“The future is unwritten.”
― Joe Strummer
 

December 5, 2017 2:35 pm  #4


Re: I unwittingly married a transwoman

Deleted

Last edited by Duped (August 28, 2019 2:28 pm)

 

December 5, 2017 4:46 pm  #5


Re: I unwittingly married a transwoman

What an awaful situation to have to deal with.  You’re absolutely right, you are not changing your sexuality so how can they ask you to be a partner to them?  If they cannot change who they say they fundamentally are then how can you?
Sadly they are not the same person anymore.  You are entitled to your feelings of hurt and betrayal.  Your spouse has put you in an impossible position. 
You did nothing wrong.  You don’t deserve this and you have every right to whatever feelings you have.

 

December 6, 2017 10:39 am  #6


Re: I unwittingly married a transwoman

Yes, I had the same feeling of relief when I found this forum and got support in the form of validation of my feelings.  
 My husband also rejects the idea that transgenderism is an "illness" although he accepts that it's a psychological condition (autogynephilia); what he says is that he has "an alternative sexuality."  Luckily he has not lost all ability to reason and has not swallowed the kool-aid labeled "sex is a social construct and therefore biological males can declare that as transpeople they are the same as women."  
  What you say about the lesbian community is insightful.  My oldest friend from graduate school, who has lived a "woman identified life" as a lesbian, partnered to the same woman for 25 years, and married, finally, a few years ago, accepts transwomen as part of the lesbian community.  Before your comment I have never considered asking her whether because my husband considers he's acting as a lesbian I am by default also a lesbian.  I'm guessing the answer would be "no."  I've been accepted as an "ally," but I've sensed in her that my marriage to a transperson gave me an upgrade in "ally" status.  
  It makes me think.  My friend and I bonded over a number of things, as friends do, one of them a commitment to feminism, and that commitment has always been something I share with the lesbian community--a belief in women's equality with men, which includes the right and ability for women to define "woman" rather than accept men's definitions of woman.  So many ways patriarchy has defined woman, all supporting the idea that men are superior and upholding patriarchy and patriarchal control and privilege!  But to me, watching the war transwomen wage on feminism and on lesbians and on women (no more protected spaces for women because women suffer from male violence; "transwomen" waging a battle against lesbians who refuse to consider "transwomen" as partners, demanding lesbians consider transwomen who retain their penises; redefining "woman" by centering transwomen in the definition), seeing men (acting as "transwomen") redefining "woman" to center the male experience (as "transwomen") is not feminist at all.  
   A long way from your individual concerns and feelings, but part of the complex of ideas raised by the "T" in LGBT.

Last edited by OutofHisCloset (December 6, 2017 10:49 am)

 

December 6, 2017 12:21 pm  #7


Re: I unwittingly married a transwoman

Deleted.

Last edited by Lynne (October 3, 2020 6:23 pm)

 

December 7, 2017 10:41 am  #8


Re: I unwittingly married a transwoman

Hi there.  Welcome to a place with many others just like you.  Even those of us who aren't dealing with trans partners (but instead, gay ones) are in a tough spot - we are somehow relegated to supporting our partners in journeys that take them away from us.  And we're not only supposed to be supportive, but somehow, excited for this new life that we never asked for, and really don't want.

Frankly, I don't even understand the trans thing when it comes to then also becoming a lesbian.  I mean, it seems to happen, so I can't say it's not a reality.  But to my straight way of thinking, if you want to be a woman, then you'd be attracted to what women are - which is men.  But I know this is illogical - there are plenty of lesbian women out there, so clearly not everyone likes the opposite sex.  Still though - I've often wondered if maybe being a trans female who likes women isn't just a stopover to eventually wanting to be with men.  Much in the same way that I think that coming out as bi when in a married, committed relationship is likely a stopover to being gay. These are just MY feelings, though - and I don't have any personal experience in either of these areas.  My ex was gay - just in denial.

I don't understand why more people don't seem to understand how devastating a change it would be for the straight spouse when their partner comes out as gay or trans.  I mean,.... how is it that the LGBT person is seen as needing to live an authentic life, but the straight partner isn't seen as needing this, too?  For me, to be living authentically would mean that I would be in a relationship with a straight man.  If my partner reveals that they aren't that after all, and then makes changes to become who he thinks he really is, then it seems that HE is then living authentically, but I no longer am.  Now, if you have no issues with your partner transitioning, and you have no issues being attracted to the new person they're becoming or the new personality that's being revealed, then fine - I guess you're both living authentically.  But if you're not 1000% cool with who your partner is becoming, then aren't YOU being required to live inauthentically just to enable their authenticity?  It would seem that in said situation, you would either need to come to some sort of middle ground that you are both comfortable and happy "enough" with, or - if that couldn't be found - end the relationship as spouses.

I don't understand the blindness of others over how much this would affect the straight spouse.  I really haven't experienced this much - likely because I was and still am surrounded by my own support network, none of which are LGBT.  Usually, when I've told people that my ex was gay, they either say something benign like, "Wow", or something more supportive, like, "That must have been really difficult for you."  And then we discuss that - how yes, it was difficult, but that I got through it.  I do tell them honestly that by the time I finally had validation that he was in fact gay, I was no longer in love with him, and had already asked for a divorce.  So it was kind of closure for me to find out that all the issues we'd suffered over the years had a reason, and the reason wasn't that I was unattractive or nuts.  But that yes - it somehow steals your past from you, unlike the end of most straight relationships.  That when I see photos of us together from earlier in our marriage - even with our children - I can't help but think, "Did he know THEN?  He knew then.  He was lying to me in this picture.  He was smiling, and I thought we were okay.  But it was all built on lies."  It's one of the things unique to the ending of our relationships.  It doesn't just steal your present, and your future, but also your past.  It re-writes your history.

You are not a lesbian, so it's ridiculous that anyone should expect you to stay in a relationship with someone who requires that of you.  And it's also ridiculous to liken this to an illness - it never was that.  It was him being dishonest with you about who he was.  And now that he's revealed the truth, he's acting like THAT's all that's at play here - not that he LIED for so many years, but that the truth is out there now, and that that's ALL that matters.  Like you can't handle the truth.  No, not true - you can't handle the lies he told you all those years. And the fact that you are being required to morph into someone else just because he wants to do that.  If HE isn't willing to be someone that he doesn't think he truly is, then why would he require that of you???  It's complete bullshit.

You have every reason to feel angry, sad, and taken advantage of.  I hate that the LGBT narrative right now is ONLY about them - as if it's NOTHING to the families that their family member is someone else, and they are REQUIRED to be supportive - to their own detriment.

You get to make YOUR own rules.  He has clearly tried to make the rules for him and you.  You don't have  to take that.  You are not required to follow blindly behind him in order to be seen as a good, worthy person.  You are that on your own.  You have every right to make decisions that are right for YOU.

Kel

Last edited by Kel (December 7, 2017 10:46 am)


You are not required to set yourself on fire to keep other people warm.
 

December 8, 2017 3:17 am  #9


Re: I unwittingly married a transwoman

Deleted

Last edited by Duped (August 28, 2019 2:17 pm)

 

December 8, 2017 6:00 am  #10


Re: I unwittingly married a transwoman

    Oh, mine has those penetrative fantasies as well; penetration--the ability to be penetrated, the desire to be penetrated--is how he defines woman.  Talk about a male definition of woman!  As if when you reduced woman to her essentials, that's what you'd focus on.  Women certainly wouldn't define ourselves by our ability to be penetrated, which is to define woman in relation to man, as if she is nothing in and of and by herself!  But to define woman that way, as "something able to be penetrated," reveals that they don't a clue what being a woman is, and, as well, that the whole attraction to "being a woman" is a sexual one.  (Which is, of course, what the psychologists Blanchard and Brown and Lawrence say--most males who declare themselves women have a sexual paraphilia.) I think what they're attracted to is neither men nor women, but to the experience of penetration.  Their real sexual orientation is to themselves acting as women, and others, well, we all--men or women--come second.
   "Rewriting reality" is a great way to phrase it, Duped.  And transwondering, yes, the appropriation of female experience is infuriating.  A feminized male is not a woman, has not lived and will never live in a female body (and even with surgery will have only the semblance of the form but never the function of one), has not been socialized as a girl/woman, has not had women's experience.  You'd think a man who wants to be a woman and enter into the society of women so much he'd alter his biology to feminize himself would also have a bit of humility and do a little soul-searching self-examination about his life as a male and how that life affected him as he seeks to belong to the group.  But no: they just carry the same entitled male sense of self over to their new feminized selves and then start trans-splaining to women what woman is.  My husband, who wants to believe (or at least act in bed as if) he's (a male fantasy version of) a lesbian, is all indignant on the behalf of lesbians. As I read somewhere, probably on a "peak trans" reddit somewhere, Transwomen: proving every day that transwomen are men. 
   Transwondering, it sounds as if you are doing some "deprograming" of yourself.  How difficult it must be, for example, to have had to rewrite material reality and use the female pronoun retroactively to describe your partner in the past, when he lived unproblematically as a man, viewed himself as a man, lived daily publicly and privately as a man, and related to others and was treated as a man, which both denies you and erases your own past, as if it didn't happen as it did.  Good ol' Soviet style rewriting of history!  Their rewriting of their past is a subject in and of itself.
   
 

 

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